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Three Federal acts contain provisions for the cooperation of their administrative agencies with the vocational rehabilitation service (the act providing for the United States Employment Service; that part of the Social Security Act providing for service to crippled children and the act providing for the operation of stands in Federal and other buildings by blind persons). All of these acts involve the finding of suitable opportunities for the placement of physically handicapped persons. The finding of such opportunities requires the cooperation of employers--particularly of employers of large groups of workersin working out standards of selection and methods of placement by which such employers can employ handicapped persons on a basis that will be fair and equitable to all concerned. The function of this agent (employment specialist) would be to secure data on existing labor standards, trade practices, and presonnel methods and then to assist State staff members in working out with employers the standards and methods to be applied in the different fields of employment in the different States.


Mr. Johnson. I have one more question. I believe that in case the appropriation was increased for agriculture and trades and industry and home economics, the administrative cost would necessarily have to be increased. I believe the item included in the estimates for administrative cost is $73,000?

Dr. STUDEBAKER. Yes, there is included in the Budget estimates for administration $264,060. Of this amount $73,000 is authorized by the George-Deen Act.

Mr. Johnson. Would you care to make an estimate or state what would be needed in case this appropriation was increased?

Dr. STUDEBAKER. It is $73,000 now. It ought to be increased by $105,000 to give us a chance not only to administer the new act, which will be much larger and much more complicated, but also to enable us to do a certain relatively small amount of good research work in connection with its administration. An increase is also needed to develop a small staff for distributive occupations--a new activity. At the present Mr. Barnhart is the only one in this field. The estimate of $178,000 included funds for that purpose.

Mr. Johnson. I believe there was $350,000 authorized under the George-Deen Act for administrative purposes alone. Is that right?

Dr. STUDEBAKER. That is right. And what we were really asking for is $178,000 of that authorization instead of the entire $350,000.

Mr. Johnson. That is the estimate that I wanted to get.


MECHANIC ARTS Mr. Rich. Shall we proceed now to take up this subject of agriculture? The item is found on page 466 of the bill and is for the further endowment of colleges of agriculture and the mechanic arts, $1,980,000. Dr. STUDEBAKER. I wish to submit the following justification:

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The act approved June 29, 1935, provides in part for the more complete endowment and support of land-grant colleges in the several States and the Territory of Hawaii, Section 22 (a) authorizes an appropriation of $980,000 for each fiscal year after the date of the enactment of the act, to be paid annually to the States and the Territory of Hawaii in equal shares. Section 22 (b) authorizes an appropriation of $500,000 for the fiscal year following the first fiscal year for which an appropriation was made, and for each of the 2 fiscal years thereafter $500,000 more than the amount authorized to be appropriated for the preceding fiscal year, and for each year thereafter $1,500,000. The appropriations authorized in this section are allotted to the States and the Territory of Hawaii in the proportion which the total population of each such State and the Territory of Hawaii bears to the total population of all the States and the Territory of Hawaii.

The appropriations under this act are in addition to and for the same purposes as the sums provided in the acts of August 30, 1890, and March 4, 1907, which provide a permanent continuing appropriation of $2,550,000 "to be applied only to instruction in agriculture, the mechanic arts, the English language, and the various branches of mathematical, physical, natural, and economic science, with special reference to their applications in the industries of life, and to the facilities for such instruction" and "for providing courses for the special preparation of instructors for teaching the elements of agriculture and the mechanic arts."

No part of this appropriation is used for administrative expenses in the Office of Education

The first appropriation was made in the amount of $980,000 for the fiscal year 1936, $1,480,000 was appropriated for 1937, and the estimate for 1938, in accordance with the provisions of the act, is submitted in the amount of $1,980,000.


Mr. Rich. There is one other question that I would like to ask Dr. Studebaker. In the field of government education it has been suggested by some people that a school of government be established in Washington similar to West Point for the Army and Annapolis for the Navy. Is your Department defending that institution?

Dr. STUDEBAKER. No; I should very much prefer to see what we can do to work through our office, especially in the Division of General Education, with the colleges and universities of the United States, to improve their methods of training for public service. That is one of the items to which I called your attention early in the hearing.

Mr. Rich. I am with you on that, but I am against this political school of government here in Washington.

EDITORIAL DEPARTMENT Mr. Rich. We would like to hear something from this department that you call editors or assistant editors. What are their duties! Give us a little explanation of that.

Dr. STUDEBAKER. Mr. Boutwell is the editor. His office edits all of these publications which I exhibited here this morning, and a list of which Dr. Goodykoontz has put in the record.

Mr. Rich. Do you have in your department any propaganda phases of education for the enlightenment of Members of Congress?

Dr. STUDEBAKER. We do not have any.

Mr. Rich. Do you have anything in your Department of Education which deals with subjects outside of education in the broad sense!

Dr. STUDEBAKER. ('an you give me an illustration of what you have in mind?

Mr. Rich. Do you get into the fields of government that are not in the educational line?

Dr. STUDEBAKER. No. We are out of many fields of education that we ought to be in.

Mr. Rich. Do you get into politics?
Dr. STUDEBAKER. Not a bit.

Mr. Rich. You spoke here this morning of having a school of government in certain groups. Are you developing anything in the line of political activities?

Dr. STUDEBAKER. No. Our point there was that in our Division of Higher Education, which deals with colleges and universities in the country, which in turn attempt, with some success, of course, to prepare people for public service, we should have a section, two or three people at least, with some small funds for printing and travel, to do the research and promotion work in the field of education for public service.

Mr. Rich. In Washington here at the present time you have the American University which has a course in political science, have you not?


Mr. Rich. You have George Washington University, and, I think, Catholic University and Georgetown. I think they all have courses of study along that line, do they not?

Dr. STUDEBAKER. Yes. But what we ought to be doing is to study the ways in which institutions throughout the country are preparing people for public service, their problems, ascertain the success that they are achieving; issue publications that inform the whole Nation, and especially those engaged in the profession of training people for public service, how to improve it. In other words, we would do in that field what we do for agriculture.

Mr. FITZPATRICK. You have no thought in your mind, then, of trying to bring in any study under Government jurisdiction?

Dr. STUDEBAKER. Not at all. It is research and service that we should provide.

Mr. FITZPATRICK. If you ever took the step of making it mandatory or compulsory on any State to take part in even one simple thing in perfecting the Government, wouldn't that be a step in that direction?

Dr. STUDEBAKER. It would.
Mr. FITZPATRICK. So I think that you must be very careful.



I must say, Mr. Congressman, that after 2 years of experience as Commissioner of Education, my answer to your question as to whether we are engaged in politics, is that I have been very much pleased with the attitude of all the people around Washington with respect to our particular office. I want to cite just one illustration, and I could give many.

The President set up the C. C. C. camp educational program, under which the United States Office of Education has to approve the appointment of the men engaged in educational work in the camps. Therefore the recommendations from the corps area officers of the C. C. C. camp organization for appointment of camp educational advisers all come to my desk, and I have to approve them.

I have approved about 3,000 of them, and I want to say that in the 2 years I have not experienced a single instance of pressure from any source, from any Congressman, or from any Senator or any one else, to make any particular appointments.

Mr. Rich. How do you get your list?

Dr. STUDEBAKER. They come up from the district advisers through the corps area advisers.

Mr. Rich. Do you mean the district officers? Dr. STUDEBAKER. No. The corps-area advisers in the Army. There are nine corps-area advisers.

Mr. Rich. Do the Army officers present those to you?

Dr. STUDEBAKER. No. In each corps-area oflice there is an educational man.

Mr. Rich. Do you appoint him?

Mr. Rich. Where do you get the appointment? From somebody that you know?

Dr. STUDEBAKER. There are only nine of those. Most of them have been in from the beginning. Some men have been selected out of the ranks below.

Mr. FITZPATRICK. Do they have to take a civil-service examination for those positions?


Mr. FITZPATRICK. How do you ascertain the quality of their knowledge and experience?

Dr. STUDEBAKER. There are form records that they must fill out showing their history and their recommendations. They are all college men.




Mr. Rich. On Saturday Mr. Gill came into my office and wantel to talk to me about education. I said that there was no use talking to me, because he would have to talk to the whole committee, and would have to talk to you first. I said if he wanted to, he could go and talk to Dr. Studebaker fint, and then come in to the committee hearing

He is here, and I don't know exactly what his program N. I don't know how much tre he wants to take. But I would like, with the permission of the members of the committee, and with your approval, to let him have a few minutes.

Dr. STIDE BAKIR. I have no objection. In fact, Mr. Gil and I have worked in the same conferences concerning this program.

Mr. Rich. I will ask Mr Gill to be as brief as he can

Mr. Gill. I represent the ('ommittee on Education of the American Prison Issociation, and am secretary of the Iniettate Committee on Prison ('omparts.

I have here a long statement, but I won't read it I will just try to touch on a few of the high spots, because I realize that perhaps I have the hardest job

Mr. RICH May I say that is your speech gives the details of what you are interested in, you may file it with the committee.

Mr. Gill. Thank you very much. I realize that I have perhaps the hardest job of any one who has stood before you today, because I am coming to support a proposal to add something to this budget. I know this year it is going to be a very difficult thing to do that. But I believe that there are reasons which are unusual enough to warrant this being given some consideration.

There are two sides to this whole crime problem. One, of course, deals with the prisoners, the criminals, who are in the prisons. One deals with the boys, the ones who are potential criminals.

Right now, as far as prisons are concerned, we are in a very bad way. There are in the prisons, the State prisons of the country, about 150,000 prisoners, of whom 100,000 are idle. That has been due partly to pressure, but in large part to restrictive Federal and State laws that have been passed in the last few years which have practically changed the character of our prisons from industrial institutions into something else.

In fact, we estimate that within a year there will be only six States in the Union outside of the Midwestern States that will be selling prison products on the open market.

That puts upon the prisons a tremendous problem, because we must do something with these 100,000 idle prisoners. We cannot turn them back into industry, because that is out of the window, not only for Congress, but the Supreme Court in its decision in January held that the sale of prison products on the open market was an evil. That settles it so far as the prison men are concerned.

There is just one fact that I want to quote from this memorandum. In the 41 State prisons, out of a total number of approximately. 41,000 prisoners we have only enough industrial products for State use, and so on, to employ 8,000 prisoners. Of the remaining 33,000 possibly 10,000 could probably be assigned to maintenance operations and 1,000 to repairs. The rest of them would be idle.

Studies made by one emergency Federal agency indicate that developments for State use might possibly employ between 25 and 30 thousand of these prisoners, leaving between 60 and 70 thousand for whom no work can be found.

For this reason, in June of last year a group of prison officials and others met with the Commissioner of Education to see what could be done from his office to help out on this problem. We found in the Office of Education, specialists in elementary education, secondary education, adult education, Negro education, vocational education, and all of that, but none of them are particularly directed toward the problem of crime or criminals.

As a result of that conference it was suggested that there be set up in the Office of Education a service for the education of criminals and for the prevention of crime, which would help to direct these specialists in other work toward this problem of crime prevention.

So much for this formal situation background.

You have today pointed out that the big program, of course, is not to increase the Budget, but to try to balance the Budget; and the question which is interesting me is, How can we justify adding even so modest an appropriation as $50,000 to this Budget under these circumstances?

Well, all I can do is perhaps this: Outside of the emergency appropriations it is my understanding that about 80 or 83 percent of the money spent by the Government is spent for war, past, present, or

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