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Mr. M'ALLISTER. Mr. President: I hope this amendment will not pass. I concur most heartily in the spirit of the resolution. It is beneath the dignity of this body assembled here to establish the organic law, to succumb to any man or party of men outside the Convention itself. I have read with surprise this morning, also, the distribution of the offices which we appointed a committee last evening to create. I do hope that we will take measures for the appointment of these officers within ourselves, and how can we do it better than by the appointment of a committee? The mode of appointing that committee is not indicated, but let it be appointed as committees are ordinarily appointed in this Convention. Who can complain of that? Surely it will be done in fairness; surely the offices will be distributed aright, and the committee should be appointed to inquire into the qualification of the persons. It is by merit they are to be distributed to those who can perform their duties best. Let the committee take that into consideration. Let nominations be made as many as you please, and let the committee select from those nominations. I hope this amend ment will not be adopted, and that the original resolution will be passed.

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tion in this house. It was an intimation from the highest source that we are to have no political discussions, and no political factions, and no political tricks in this body. Well, now, sir, the manner in which this body was elected shows that the people of Pennsylvania intended that in everything done by this body the minority should be represented. There are three hundred and thirty-five thousand tax-payers in Pennsylvania who are called the minority, and they are represented by a body of men upon this floor. Is it in accordance with the spirit of these measures for a portion of this body to assemble in a tavern in secret caucus, and there decide that no representative of those three hundred and thirty-five thousand taxpayers shall be represented in the official action of this body? That no man shall be made secretary of this body, who may be the fittest man in the Commonwealth, and much fitter than any one-any caucus-may offer to us; that he is to be excluded even from an election because of a midnight caucus of violent partisans, and animated by that spirit that characterizes their narrow, nasty politics, they decide that nobody but their pets shall be admitted within the ring. Sir, is that the spirit in which we are to start out in the delibMr. WOODWARD. Mr. President: I rise erations of this body? erations of this body? I say it is a departto support the resolution of my friend from ure, a gross departure, from what has Philadelphia, and I concur in what has been already occurred in our midst, and which said in support of that resolution. Mr. Pres- augurs badly for the future, if this is to be ident, if I read aright the legislation that led tolerated. Now, the resolution offered by to the convening of this body, and the pub- my friend from Philadelphia (Mr. Gowen) lic opinion which called it into existence, it is catholic; it is comprehensive. It prowas that the fundamental law of Pennsyl- poses that you, sir, shall appoint a comvania should be revised without the slight-mittee of ten from this body, over whose est reference to the partisan politics of the deliberations you shall preside, and to clay. I believe that was the general desire that committee the whole question of offiof the people of Pennsylvania. They sent cering this Convention is to be submitted. us here for that purpose. How a portion It seems to me that it would be in accordof this body has been impressed with that ance with the spirit which manifestly anisentiment was shown by the fact that mated the people of Pennsylvania in callwhen the time came for the election of a ing this Convention into existence. Now, presiding officer no other name was offered for our own sake, as well as for the sake in competition with that of the distin- of the people of Pennsylvania, I trust we guished gentleman who presides over our are not to make a gross and arbitrary dedeliberations. By common consent he parture from that good spirit which seems was accepted without a dissenting vote, thus far to have animated us. On the and without the suggestion of any other contrary, I should hope that by the comname. Now, that seemed to me to be in to me to be in mon consent which elevated you approaccordance with the spirit that I suppose priately to the chair you occupy, this resohad animated everybody concerned in lution might be adopted; and to the calling this Convention into existence; committee presided over by yourself, I, but, sir, we had not deliberated long for one, am willing to commit entirely and before I heard that presiding officer call- without question all these individual aping a member on this floor to order for pointees. I pledge myself to vote for the alluding to an instance of partisan distinc- report of that committee, whoever may be

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the individuals named. For these reasons I support the resolution, and hope it may be adopted.

Mr. MACVEAGH. Mr. President: It is certainly not desirable that the position of any gentlemen, who will support General Lilly's amendment, should be misunder

stood, and their position would certainly be wholly misunderstood if it was assumed that that position was correctly stated by the gentleman from Philadelphia, who offered the resolution, or the distinguished gentleman who has just supported it. We are as anxious, at least I am as anxious, and I am very sure that General Lilly and the gentlemen who will support his amendment are as anxious as any gentleman here, to proceed to the graver labors of this Convention absolutely free from any spirit of partisanship, confining ourselves, in the most liberal and catholic interpretation of our du ties, to those duties in their fullest scope; but, whether rightly or wrongly, there are some of us who believe that upon those gentlemen who were elected by the majority of the voters of this Commonwealth, devolves the simple and unimportant duty of selecting officers who are to do the work of this Convention as its employees. We are capable of that process known as detachment; we can look at this branch of our duty as a duty de volving upon us, a responsibility upon us, and when that is discharged we can go forward to the remaining duties of this Convention, and propose to do so precisely in the spirit the gentleman has indicated; and even now, for my part, I decline Judge Woodward's challenge; I shall not call the party with which he is associated a "ring" I shall not insinuate that the majority of the

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voters of this State are not an honest majority of its voters; Iscorn the imputation for that party with which I am known to be associated; I do not propose to attempt to assign it to gentlemen who differ from me; I have no words of unkindness or feelings of bitterness towards anybody; I propose to know no lines of distinction in the work of this Convention; but, the very act which calls us together contemplates that certain gentlemen of this Convention are elected by one class of voters, and certain other members of this Convention are elected by another class of voters; I would have been very glad, if that was the only consideration, to have had this duty shifted to the minority from the majority, if the voters had so decided,

but the voters have decided otherwise then, I think, it is a shrinking from duty and avoidance of proper responsibility, office who are equally qualified, equally when candidates are presented for an fitted, for they are presumedly so, that I should vote alternately; first, for a gentleman who voted for me, and then for a

gentleman who voted against me, but the employees of this Convention, through that, in this small matter of appointing the various grades of limited salary which have been reported and adopted here this morning, other things being equal, I' the class of voters who sent me to this should vote for a person who belongs to Convention; that is all, as I understand, that there is in it; therefore, I shall support General Lilly's amendment.

On agreeing to the amendment offered by Mr. Lilly, the yeas and nays were required by Mr. Hanna and Mr. Lamberton, and were as follow, viz:

YEAS..

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Messrs. Armstrong, Ainey, Andrews, Addicks, Bartholomew, Baily, (Perry,) Baker, Bannan, Bardsley, Beebe, Bowman, Broomall, Carey, Carter, Cochran, Collins, Corson, Craig, Curry, Davis, Dimmick, Darlington, Edwards, Ewing, Fell, Finney, Fulton, Funck, Hanna, Hazzard, Horton, Howard, Knight, Lawrence, Lilly, Lear, Littleton, MacConnell, M'Culloch, MacVeagh, Mann, Mantor, Minor, Newlin, Niles, Palmer, H. W., Parsons, Patterson, (Lancaster,) Porter, Pughe, Purviance, (Allegheny,)Purviance, (Butler,) Reynolds, James L., Rooke, Runk, Russell, Simpson, Stanton, Stewart, Struthers, Turrell, Van Reed, Walker, White, (Indiana,) White, David N., Wetherill, (Philadelphia) and White, J. W. F.——67.

NAYS.

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Messrs. Alricks, Achenbach, Baer, Black, (York,) Bailey, (Huntingdon,) Black, (Greene,) Boyd, Brodhead, Brown, Barclay, Curtin, Campbell, Corbett, Cassidy, Church, Clark, Cronmiller, Cuyler, Dodd, Dallas, DeFrance, Dunning, Ellis, Elliott, Freeze, Gowen, Gibson, Gilpin, Guthrie, Hall, Harvey, Hay, Hemphill, Heverin, Hopkins, Hunsicker, Kaine, Lamberton, Landis, Long, M'Allister, M'Camant, M'Clean, M'Murray, Metzger, Mott, Purman, Palmer, G. W., Patterson, (Allegheny,) Patton, Reynolds, S. H., Read, (Philadelphia,) Reed, (Mifflin,) Rhone, Ross, Smith, (Allegheny,) Sharpe, Smith, (Berks,) Smith, (Lancaster,) Temple,

Woodward, Wetherill, (Schuylkill,) Wherry, Worrell and Meredith, President-66.

Brown, Barclay, Curtin, Campbell, Corbett, Cassidy, Church, Clark, Cronmiller, Cuyler, Dodd, Dallas, DeFrance, Dun

So the question was determined in the ning, Ellis, Elliott, Freeze, Gowen, Gibaffirmative.

son, Gilpin, Guthrie, Hall, Harvey, Hay, Hemphill, Heverin, Hopkins, Hunsicker, Kaine, Lamberton, Landis, Long, M'Allister, M'Camant, M'Clean, M'Murray, Metzger, Mott, Purman, Palmer, G. W., Patterson, (Allegheny,) Patton, Reynolds, S. H., Read, (Philadelphia,) Reed, (Mifflin,) Rhone, Ross, Smith, (Allegheny,) Sharpe, Smith, (Berks,) Smith, (Lancaster,) Temple, Woodward, Wetherill, (Schuylkill,) Wherry and Worrell-35.

Mr. KAINE moved to further amend by adding the following:

"That the officers of this Convention be elected in the following manner: The Chief Clerk and two Assistants be elected at one and the same ballot by each delegate voting for two candidates, and the highest in vote be the Chief Clerk and the two next highest the Assistants; that each delegate vote for one candidate for each of the other classes of officers, and the highest in vote be declared the principal officer and the next highest the Assistant."

Mr. HARRY WHITE. Mr. President: I raise the question of order as to this amendment, that the amendment is incompatible with the amendment which the House has just adopted. I call the attention of the House to the fact. I will merely state that my understanding is that the House has just adopted a simple resolution that we now proceed to nominate and elect a Chief Clerk. The motion of the gentlemen from Fayette (Mr. KAINE) is to amend that by providing for the manner of the election of the other officers. I think it incompatible with the amendment just adopted by the House.

Mr. KAINE. Mr. President: I take it that the motion made by myself is strictly in order. The amendment just passed by this House is, that this House will proceed to the election of a Clerk. My amendment provides the manner in which that Clerk shall be elected, as well as the other officers of this House. Is there anything inconsistent in that? It is carrying out the very spirit of the resolution which has just been adopted by this House, and I hope the House will adopt my amendment, and that the election of officers will take place in accordance with that resolution.

The PRESIDENT. The Chair is of the opinion that the amendment is in order.

On the question, will the Convention agree to the amendment?

The yeas and nays were required by Mr. Kaine and Mr. Brodhead, and were as follow, viz:

YEAS.

Messrs. Alricks, Achenbach, Baer, Black, (York,) Bailey, (Huntingdon,) Biddle, Black, (Greene,) Boyd, Brodhead,

:

NAYS.

Messrs. Armstrong, Ainey, Andrews, Addicks, Bartholomew, Baily, (Perry,) Baker, Bannan, Bardsley, Beebe, Bowman, Broomall, Carey, Carter, Cochran, Collins, Corson, Craig, Curry, Davis, Dimmick, Darlington, Edwards, Ewing, Fell, Finney, Fulton, Funck, Hanna, Hazzard, Horton, Howard, Knight, Lawrence, Lilly, Lear, Littleton, MacConnell, M'Culloch, MacVeagh, Mann, Mantor, Minor, Newlin, Niles, Palmer, H. W., Parsons, Patterson, (Lancaster,) Porter, Pughe, Purviance, (Allegheny,) Purviance, (Butler,) Reynolds, James L., Rooke, Runk, Russell, Simpson, Stanton, Stewart, Struthers, Turrell, Van Reed, Walker, White, (Indiana,) White, David N., Wetherill, (Philadelphia,) White J. W. F. and Meredith, President—68.

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The yeas and nays were required by Mr. Hopkins and Mr. MacVeagh, and were as follow, viz:

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The PRESIDENT ruled that no debate was in order during the call of the yeas and nays, except that a member might ask to be excused from voting.

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Messrs. Armstrong, Ainey, Andrews, Addicks, Bartholomew, Baily, (Perry,)⠀⠀ Mr. M'CLEAN (when his name was Baker, Bannan, Bardsley, Beebe, Bow- called) asked to be excused from voting. man, Broomall, Carey, Carter, Cochran, The PRESIDENT announced the vote, Collins, Corson, Craig, Curry, Davis, Dim- and declared D. L. Imbrie elected as mick, Darlington, De France, Edwards, Chief Clerk of the Convention. Ewing, Fell, Finney, Fulton, Funck, Hanna, Hazzard, Horton, Howard, Knight, Lawrence, Lilly, Lear, Littleton, M'Allister, MacConnell, M'Culloch, M'Murray, MacVeagh, Mann, Mantor, Minor, Newlin, Niles, Palmer, H. W., Parsons, Patterson, (Lancaster,) Porter, Pughe, Purviance, (Allegheny,) Purviance, (Butler,) Reynolds, James L., Rooke, Runk, Russell, Simpson, Stanton, Stewart, Struthers, Turrell, Van Reed, Walker, White, (Indiana,) White, David N., Whetherill, (Philadelphia,) White, J. W. F. and Meredith, President-71. NAYS.

YEAS.

move that the gentleman have leave to state his reasons for his vote.

Mr. SIMPSON offered the following resolution, which was twice read:

Resolved, That the Convention will now proceed to the nomination and election of the remaining officers designated in the report of the Committee, in the order named in said report.

Chair.

The PRESIDENT. The Chair is of opinion that on the call of the ayes and noes no member can make any answer but "aye" or "no." If the Chair is mistaken in that opinion, we will submit the question to the House, if the gentlemen desire it.

Mr. GowEN. Mr. President: I understand that one serious objection to the resolution I offered before was, that the committee to be appointed was to be an even number, and therefore, according to parliamentary usage, did not give the majority of the committee to the majority of the House. I did not have any intention of doing so at the time, and therefore, in order to relieve us of this voting, which will occupy the whole day, I offer the following as an amendment to the resolution just offered: Strike out all after the word "resolved" and insert as follows: "That the President appoint a committee of nine, of which he shall be one, and be the chairman, to report the names of suitable persons to fill the remaining offices of the

Messrs. Black, (York,) Ellis, Freeze, M'Camant, Purman and Rhone.-6

Mr. BAER (when his name was called) said: Mr. President: I have not occupied the time of this Convention hitherto

The PRESIDENT. Debate is not in order.

Mr. BAER. I wish to explain the reason for the vote I shall give.

The PRESIDENT. It is not in order Convention."

now.

Mr. HOPKINS (when his name was called) said: I desire to ask of the Chair a question. [Cries of "order, order."]

Mr. WHITE (Indiana.) Mr. President: Mr. BAER. I therefore, sir, decline to I have but one remark to make in connecvote. tion with the amendment of the gentleman from Philadelphia (Mr. Gowen.) It occurs to me that it will result in a procrastination of our proceedings, and delay us from entering upon the performance of that legitimate duty for which the people

Mr. HOPKINS. Is it not in order to ask the Chair a question? The PRESIDENT. Certainly, the gen- have elected us. tleman is in order.

Mr. HOPKINS. The question I desire to ask is this: Whether, under parliamentary law, a member has not a right to give the reasons for his vote when he is called upon to vote? I ask that question of the

Something has been said about politics here. It occurs to me that the sooner we perform the function of electing, or selecting, if you please, the officers that have been designated by the resolution which this Convention passed this morning, the sooner we will be relieved from a subject which must necessarily annoy everybody in a body of this kind at the threshold of its organization. I am, therefore, opposed to the amendment of the gentleman from Philadelphia, (Mr. Gowen,) and I trust, inasmuch as we have just elected a Chief Clerk without any party vote in this

A delegate inquired if it was in order to Convention, that we will proceed to com

plete our organization immediately by the election of the balance of the officers.

The PRESIDENT. The President would be much obliged to the gentleman offering this amendment if he will strike out the name of the President.

Convention, as the selection and election
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of its subordinate officers.
come to this result, that when the people
of this Commonwealth had diligently
sought by an act thoroughly discussed,
and carefully framed to prevent the ex-

Mr. GowEN so modified his amend- istence of party politics in the action of ment. this Convention, we would be brought down to the result that one-fourth of the body would control its organization. As a citizen of this Commonwealth, and as a member of this body, I protest against the application of any such doctrine.

I have no choice of individuals. I can say nothing against the gentleman named as Chief Clerk, and nothing against the list of names printed in the morning papers, indecently, I thought, before it ever reached this House. It is from no preference to any individual, but it is because that now, at the very threshold of our deliberations, is the time for gentlemen to record their solemn protest against the introduction of party predilections into this House.

Mr. M'ALLISTER. Mr. President: I desire to say a word, and only a word, in reference to this resolution. I can indulge in no delusive hope that anything I can say will prevent the passage of this resolution. I believe its passage is ordained by a power higher than reason, higher than judgment, higher than the consciences of gentlemen-even by the power of party. I listened to the words from the lips of the gentleman who introduced the resolution for the election of a Chief Clerk of this House, and the train of reasoning which should have led hịm to precisely the opposite conclusion to the one to which he did arrive. I understood him to allude to the act which created this body, and to point to the fact that the people of this State had ordained that the Convention should recognize the existence of different parties. If that were the fact, then the organization of this Convention should be in harmony with the organic law by which it was elected. If it was the object of the people of this State to prevent a partisan body, and secure a body which would represent the opinions of all parties in the Commonwealth, then throughout the organization of the House the same doctrine should be recognized, and the same method of election pursued. If it was not intended by the people of this Commonwealth that one political party should control the action of this Convention, and that the instrument proposed to be produced should not represent the views of one particular party, then should the will of the people, in the method of organizing the Convention, be recognized and carried out.

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Let us observe where this will lead us. This Convention is very nearly equally balanced, or supposed to be so, so far as its political proclivities are concerned. Let me suppose that little more than half of this body belongs to the dominant party, then by power of party caucus, one-fourth of the body would control its organization, because of the dominant party representing but one more than half of this body, it might as well control the entire policy and legislation of this

Mr. SIMPSON. Mr. President: I take it for granted that this body will be governed by the rule of all deliberative bodies, and that is that the majority of its members shall govern it. The votes of this body can elect its officers just as well, in my judgment, as a committee of nine, or any other number less than the whole. For one, I object to and protest against the appointment of a committee of ninè, or of any number less than the whole number of members, to determine for me who shall be the employees of this Convention. We are just as competent to sit in our seats and elect the proper persons as any committee selected from this body. I take it that, if we proceed to vote down the amendment and adopt the resolution, we will save time in the operation, for the majority can select officers now, without the necessity of having a committee appointed, to have a wrangle, perhaps, over every individual officer.

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Mr. WOODWARD. Mr. President: One word. In the Convention of 1837-8, of which you and I were members, the party-I speak with all reverence—I do not know what name they had at that time, but I think they answered to the party that now rule this House-the dominant party of that Convention, whatever they were called, elected Mr. John Sargeant, President, and Mr. Samuel Shocch, Secretary of the Convention; and then, sir, that party, that dominant party, elected Mr. Francis R. Shunck, Assistant

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