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nent sessions of the Convention? If the course Judge Woodward suggests is adopted, undoubtedly there will be no necessity for permanent sessions after a week or ten days. It seems to me that in all fairness to everybody, we will be far better prepared to decide upon the matter in a week from now, or even less time after the Convention has had a full view of what will be the probable course of its business.
Mr. SIMPSON. I move to amend the amendment, by striking out the word "permanent," and inserting in lieu thereof the words, "from and after the 9th day of December next." That is, that from and after the 9th day of December next, the sessions of this Convention will be held in Philadelphia.
are not in à condition to decide when or where we shall adjourn to. It is our duty to to lay out our work and get it into the hands of the proper committees. When we shall have done that, I hope the Convention will adjourn for a time long enough to enable those committees to do their work most carefully. A week, sir, is not long enough; nor is a month. And, And, in my judgment, it would be a great mistake for us to meet this side of the holidays when. we do adjourn. Then the Legislature will be in session here, and obviously then will be the time to accept this polite invitation from the city of Philadelphia. Now, it seems to me that it would be the better way to lay all these resolutions on the table for the present, and address ourselves to the question whether we shall
The PRESIDENT ruled the amendment have one committee or several committees out of order.
Mr. WETHERILL (Philadelphia.) seems to me that it would be impossible for us to fix any definite time. We may be ready to adjourn this day week, or we may be ready before. If this Convention will simply accept the invitations of the councils of the city of Philadelphia, and fix the time hereafter, it seems to me that will cover the whole ground. I move you, therefore, that the amendment offered by the gentleman from Dauphin (Mr. MacVeagh) be amended, by striking out all after the word "resolved," and inserting the following:
"That the invitation be accepted, and the time of adjournment thereto be hereafter determined."
Mr. WOODWARD. Mr. President: Let me say that, in my humble opinion, this whole discussion is premature. I do not believe we are in a condition to decide when we will go to Philadelphia, or where we shall meet, until we have appointed the committees to do the work of this body. We are here, as I understand, for the purpose of proposing amendments to the Constitution, to be submitted to the people of Pennsylvania. Those amendments must be carefully considered and carefully framed, and that can only be done through committees. Those committees must have time to do their work properly. There is no proposition, at present, before this body for the appointment of those committees, and until we shall have appointed one committee-which I believe would be the better way—or several committees, to take up the subjects we came here to Harrisburg to consider, to prepare our amendments, I submit we
to consider these amendments. Let those committees be appointed, then we will consider when to adjourn, and whether we shall adjourn to Philadelphia. Ivery much hope ample time will be given to these committees, and it cannot be given unless we adjourn until after the holidays. I drew up a resolution on this subject, which I do not mean to offer; but that it may place the thought in my mind before the convention, I will ask the Clerk to read it. It expresses my whole thought on the subject. I ask that it may be read as a part of my speech.
The resolution was read, as follows:
Be it resolved, That all the articles, sections and clauses of the Constitution of Pennsylvania, including the schedule, together with all propositions that may be submitted to the Convention for the alteration or amendment of said Constitution, be and the same are hereby referred to a committee of members, to be appointed by the Chair, whereof the President of the Convention shall be chairman, whose duty it shall be to consider, frame and report such alterations and amendments of the said Constitution as they may deem necessary and expedient. And to enable the said committee the better to prepare their report, the Convention, before considering any constitutional amendment, will adjourn to meet on the day of January, A. D. 1873, in the city of Philadelphia, in such hall as the mayor and councils of said city shall furnish, and the report of the committee shall be submitted to the Convention for its consideration, directly the body re-assembles in pursuance of such adjournment.
Mr. BARTHOLOMEW. Mr. President: I desire to say that the adoption of the original resolution, in my judgment, does not interfere with the object which my friend Judge Woodward desires to accomplish. In the resolution I offered, time is carefully avoided. The time for the adjournment of this body and its re-assembling in permanent session is not referred to; but I thought it eminently proper when the communication was received from the city of Philadelphia, making this offer, that some action should be taken upon it, that we should either accept or reject it, and that the acceptance should be signified to them that they might be enabled to make such preparations as would necessarily be involved in our adjournment or removal from here to that city. Now I take it that under that resolution all the necessary business of this Convention can be gone through with. It can be thoroughly accomplished, and then it is for the Convention to say that they have so completed their organization as to be ready to adjourn for the purpose either of re-assembling here or elsewhere. There is no necessity for having the time inserted in the resolution; leave that for the future action of the Convention. When they have accomplished what they desire here, have perfected their organization and got into working trim, then they can adjourn for the Convention to re-assemble in the city of Philadelphia or here. That an adjournment over the holidays is necessary, I think we all acquiesce in and agree to. Now, Mr. President, I do think that the resolution as offered was certainly offered, not with any design for an immediate adjournment, but that the business of this body should be gone into so far as to place it in a condition to do the work devolving upon it, to wit: By the appointment of its committees, the committees to put it in shape for effective operations, then for the Convention to fix the time. Now, the word permanent" is used in that resolution. My friend objects to the word. I think it is proper, for when we refer to the act we find that we are to assemble here at Harrisburg, that we are here to organize, and that the power is vested in us to adjourn at such time and to such place as we may deem proper. It certainly uses language conveying at least the idea to the mind that this is not to be our permanent location, because the Legislature no doubt contemplated the fact, which is a fact, that the Legislature is to assemble in these halls, and that it is to be occupied, so that it
would be impossible for us to be in session at one and the same time. Therefore, I take it that we have yet to fix the permanent place for the working of this Convention-that this is not its permanent location, that that is not yet decided upon. It seems to me that the language of the resolution is proper. As I said before, it does not interfere with the business of the Convention. We have this communication laid before us, and why not act upon it? Certainly it is no more than courtesy, and no more than right, that we should give it immediate action, such as its generosity and liberality demands of us. It was in this spirit I offered the resolution, and I hope it will be acted upon before the adjournment of this body.
Mr. D. N. WHITE. Mr. President: I hope this resolution will not be pressed upon us to-day. We gentlemen who live in the far west want time to think about this. We do not want to be driven into a measure of this kind, which affects us so seriously. Besides I am informed the councils of the city of Pittsburg have passed a similar resolution, which will probably be here to-morrow. Let us wait and have that here before we jump so hastily to a conclusion in this matter. It may be, and I suppose we are, in the hands of those in favor of going to Philadelphia; that is very evident. But do not hurry us gentlemen; give us time to think about it. You require us to go one hundred miles further from our homes, put us to more expense, more time is lost to us, and I hope the Convention will not hurry this matter. There can be no harm in letting it lie over a day or two until we can think about it and look over the ground. I hope, therefore, the resolution will not be adopted.
Mr. LANDIS. Mr. Speaker: I move you that the further consideration of this subject be indefinitely postponed.
The motion of Mr. Landis was not agreed to.
Mr. DARLINGTON. Mr. Speaker: I am decidedly in favor of removing from this place, because it is perfectly apparent we cannot get through here in time for the Legislature to occupy these halls. No man, who has thought at all upon this subject, I presume, supposes we can perform our duty in that time. We must provide another place. That place, I think, in the minds of a majority of the Convention, manifestly is Philadelphia. I shall vote for it. I shall vote for accepting the invitation of the councils of the city of Phila
delphia, with a modification, to wit: That not the city, but the State, shall pay the expense, which I propose to vote for at the proper time. But, sir, I would also have a committee appointed. I accept the idea of my friend (Judge Woodward) to some extent, that a committee of this Convention be appointed, who shall inquire into the matter, visit the city of Philadelphia, and, in concert with the councils, decide upon a proper place and a proper time. This also should be done early, because it would take sometime to fit up a hall. But we are not yet organized. Our organization is not yet completed. We require a Chief Clerk or a Secretary to be elected. We ought also to further inquire what other officers, if any, are necessary to discharge the duties appertaining to this body. In order that we may get at the proper business of to-day, to wit: The election of a Secretary, and the appointment of a committee to ascertain what other officers we should have beside, I move to postpone the further consideration of the resolution and its amendments for the present.
Mr. GowEN. Mr. President: I would suggest the following as an amendment to the original resolution, and I think, from what I have heard in this hall, it will meet with the views of a large number of the delegates: Strike out all after the word "resolved" and insert the following:
"That the invitation of the councils of the city of Philadelphia be accepted, and that all the sessions of this body, after January 1, 1873, be held in that city."
Mr. WETHERILL (Philadelphia) withdrew his amendment.
Mr. H. W. SMITH. Mr. President: The organization of the Convention is provided for in the third section of the act of April 11, 1872, and it authorizes the election of one of their number as President, and, after the members are sworn in, such other officers as may be needed in the transaction of its business. That provision of the section has not yet been fully complied with; and I submit that the paper presented to the Convention by the councils of the city of Philadelphia, and the resolutions that followed, are entirely out of order, and that the Convention must be fully organized under the third section of the act of Assembly before anything of that kind can be done, or before the Convention can proceed to business. Now, after providing for the meeting of the Convention on this day, and the reading of the proclamation of the Governor, it is provided that, "there
upon said Convention shall proceed to organize by electing one of their number as President, and, after the members are sworn in, such other officers as may be needed in the transaction of business.”
Now, I do contend, under this law, the plain letter of the law and the spirit of it, that the Convention can do no business until they are fully organized, as provided by this third section of the law, and that the reception of the paper, and the resolution and amendments following, are entirely out of order. We are scarcely warm in our seats before an attempt is made to take this Convention to Philadelphia, when there are other places that are equally desirable, where the same or better accommodations can be had. Let us organize the Convention fully, and let something be done, as has been suggested by Judge Woodward, and proceed as far as we can, and then, if the majority of the Convention decide in favor of going to Philadelphia, we can go there.
The PRESIDENT. Does the gentleman submit that as a question of order?
Mr. H. W. SMITH. I do.
The PRESIDENT. The Chair will submit that question to the Convention. The question now is, is any other business in order except the election of a Clerk and officers?
On the question, is the point of order well taken?
The yeas and nays were required by Mr. Smith (Berks) and Mr. MacVeagh, and were as follow, viz:
Messrs. Alricks, Achenbach, Baily, (Perry,) Beebe, Bowman, Broomall, Barclay, Church, Craig, Dimmick, Darlington, De France, Dunning, Elliott, Fell, Finney, Freeze, Fulton, Funck, Guthrie, Hazzard, Hopkins, Howard, Kaine, Lamberton, Lawrence, Landis, M'Culloch, M'Murray, MacVeagh, Metzger, Mott, Niles, Patterson, (Allegheny,) Patterson, (Lancaster,) Purviance, (Butler,) Reynolds, James L., Rooke, Russell, Sharpe, Smith, (Berks,) Stewart, Struthers, Van Reed, Woodward, Wetherill, (Schuylkill,) Wherry and White, J. W. F.-48.
Messrs. Armstrong, Ainey, Andrews, Addicks, Bartholomew, Baer, Black, (York,) Bailey, (Huntingdon,) Baker, Bannan, Bardsley, Biddle, Black, (Greene,) Boyd, Brodhead, Brown, Curtin, Campbell, Corbett, Carey, Carter, Cassidy, Clark, Cochran, Collins, Corson, Cronmiller, Curry,
Cuyler, Davis, Dodd, Dallas, Ellis, Ed- Mr. JOHN PRICE WETHERILL. Mr.
wards, Ewing, Gowen, Gilpin, Hall, Hanna, Harvey, Hay, Hemphill, Heverin, Horton, Hunsicker, Knight, Lilly, Lear, Littleton, Long, M'Allister, M'Camant, M'Clean, M'Connell, Mann, Mantor, Minor, Newlin, Purman, Palmer, H. W., Palmer, G. W., Parsons, Patton, Porter, Pughe, Purviance, (Allegheny,) Reynolds, S. H., Read, (Philadelphia,) Reed, (Mifflin,) Rhone, Ross, Runk, Simpson, Smith, (Allegheny,) Smith, (Lancaster,) Stanton, Turrell, Walker, White, (Indiana,) White, David N., Wetherill, (Philadelphia,) Worrell and Meredith, President --83.
President: It seems to me this resolution is rather indefinite, and that it would re. quire a considerable amount of time, as well as a considerable sum of money, to place a suitable hall in readiness for a committee to say whether they will take it or not, and therefore it is rather an indefinite resolution. My idea is, that if this Convention see fit, a committee should be appointed to meet with a like committee from Philadelphia, and they together select a suitable hall. The city of Philadelphia has agreed to place that hall in a condition that will be entirely acceptable to every member of this Convention, they
So the question was determined in the paying the cost of the same. It seems to negative. me if we simply accept the invitation, and The question recurring on the amend- fix the time, that we will, after the first ment offered by Mr. MacVeagh,
Mr. TURRELL moved to amend the same, by striking out the words proposed to be inserted, and inserting in lieu thereof the following:
of January, hold our meetings in Philadelphia. The councils of Philadelphia will have ample time to prepare the hall, and there will be no more trouble about
it. It seems to me the amendment of the gentleman from Philadelphia covers the whole ground; therefore, I withdrew my amendment to give room for his.
Mr. MACVEAGH. Mr. President: This
Resolved, That the invitation of Phila delphia to hold our sessions in that city be accepted, and that upon information that a suitable hall is in readiness, this Conven- question ought not to be put upon the tion will appoint a committee to examine ground of the courtesy due to the councils the same, and report thereon to this body, and upon such report the Convention will
then determine the time or date of removal thither, and notify the authorities of Philadelphia accordingly.
of Philadelphia, for courtesy does not require an immediate answer; and at least that courtesy would be equally due to the Councils of the city of Pittsburg, to wait for the reception of their invitation before we formally close upon the proposition; and it seems to me equally due to the au
paring themselves to make a proposition of this character to the Convention. Nothing of that kind was expected to be decided to-day, I venture to say, by a very large majority of this Convention, and it is, therefore, it seems to me, not acting with special courtesy to Philadelphia, but with a lack of it to other places. While it is defensible, perhaps, upon other grounds, I do not think it is upon the ground of courtesy, without affording the city of Harrisburg and other cities mentioned, an opportunity to present communications upon the subject.
Mr. J. R. READ. Mr. President: It is unnecessary for me to say that I am in favor of the resolution offered by my friend thorities of this city, who have been prefrom Schuylkill (Mr. Bartholomew.) It occurs to me that the passage of all these amendments is only postponing a decision that had better be made now. It occurs to me, that as a matter of courtesy, we should accept or decline the invitation of the municipal authorities of Philadelphia. I understand that the amendment offered leaves the time of adjournment entirely in the hands of the Convention, and I concede that that is the proper place for it to be. I can hardly agree in some views expressed by gentlemen of the Convention, that it is necessary for us to name the time. It may not be necessary for us to remain here until the first of January. The question of its permanent sessions is one that the Convention can decide at any time; and as that power is so entirely in the hands of this Convention, I see no impropriety in coming to a vote upon the question of accepting or refusing the invitation of the councils of Philadelphia.
Mr. TURRELL'S amendment to the amendment of Mr. MacVeagh was not agreed to.
The amendment proposed by Mr. Gowen was then offered as an amendment to the amendment of Mr. MacVeagh, and read as follows:
Resolved, That the invitation of the councils of Philadelphia be accepted, and
that all the sessions of this Convention
Mr. D. W. PATTERSON. I had hoped, Mr. President, to have avoided saying anything upon this question; but now, on its final motion, I would beg to say that I had hoped this Convention had met for the purpose of performing the duties imposed upon it, and that in the most expeditious way. I had hoped that the member from Schuylkill would have answered some of those very practical questions put to him by the honorable gentleman from Philadelphia, which were certainly wise suggestions, it seems to me, for promoting the organization of this Convention and facilitating its work. I did not hear any very intelligent answer to those questions put to the original mover of that resolution. I do not think any intelligent answer can be made to them, because certainly the resolution offered by that gentleman was inconsistent with itself. No. member has denied but what we are in our permanent sittings now, and will be to-morrow, just as much as at any time, and therefore the original resolution was inconsistent with itself.
But I see the thing is fixed, Mr. President, and we are not to give the city of Harrisburg or the city of Pittsburg any opportunity of making the same very 'kind invitation which the city of Philadelphia made to this Convention. It is certainly a very kind invitation; and I know a great many of the gentlemen there, as well as many gentlemen who are in this Convention, and I am certainly very much obliged to them for that invitation.
But I am astonished-no, I am not astonished-but I will say, Mr. President, that I have seen to-day in this Convention what I apprehend no members of this Convention have ever seen before; I have seen a united vote by every gentleman residing in the city of Philadelphia or its surroundings. It is a strong team to get over; but it is something, I apprehend, that we will never see again after this question is settled.
It might be that in this Convention, after we deliberate coolly, and perfect our reports, we might have, probably, a united vote from that section, but I think it is very doubtful that we will ever hear such a vote again as has been given here this
morning. The thing is fixed, and I merely rise to protest against it so far as I am able, for the reason that I believe it will prolong the sessions of this Convention; for the reason that I believe the business of this Convention will not be so well digested and so well considered.
The last Convention, of which you, Mr. President, had the honor of being a member, adjourned from this place to Philadelphia, and I heard many of your colleagues say that it was with the greatest difficulty that they could at any time get a full house; that their Philadelphia friends were so good, and kind, and friendly, and wined them and dined them every day, that many of them were totally unfit for business. [Laughter.] Now, while I admire their kindness and humanity, I don't want to put myself in the way of temptation. You know there is an old prayer, "Lead us not into temptation," and I believe every member of this Convention will work just twice as much in Harrisburg as in Philadelphia. Such has been the experience of many experienced men in reference to legislation.
Now, my friend from Chester (Mr. Darlington) said he was in favor of going away from Harrisburg because it was manifest that we could not finish our business in this place. Why is that so manifest to my friend or any other gentleman? We have a library room up hère, 105 feet by 55, light, pleasant, comfortable, sufficient to hold every member of this Convention. We have the books of the library there-the machinery by which we do our business right at hand; and the city of Harrisburg proposes to fix that room up at its own expense for this Convention. Why should we go to the expense of having a hall in Philadelphia ?— because I have heard nothing in regard to the payment for a hall except one word from my friend from the city, and he got over it very quickly. He said that the councils had proposed to furnish a hall and pay for it. Those were the only words I heard about payment.
Now, Mr. President, when we have this hall here better in order, acoustics and comfort, than any hall-notwithstanding the greatness of Philadelphia-they can produce there, why should we make this effort to remove this Convention away from this place, where we are all removed from our business, with nothing to do but attend to the legitimate duties of this Convention? I think our friends who have voted for this resolution, or design