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enough. The resolution I have offered is simply to bring the matter

intelligibly before the Convention, and I move its adoption.

MR. BEERSTECHER. Mr. President: I second the resolution of

Mr. Wilson. I believe, sir, that such a committee ought to be appointed.
Of course, the action of the committee will not be binding upon the
House unless adopted. I second the resolution.

MR. BARBOUR. Mr. President: I move to amend the resolution by
inserting at the end thereof the words "except a Phonographic Re-
porter." I do so, because I believe that the committee who has in
charge that matter ought to be experts. They should take the matter
into consideration, and decide whether the work should be done by
contract or a reporter elected.

MR. O'SULLIVAN. Mr. President: I second the amendment.

MR. WILSON. Mr. President: Under the resolution which I offer,

the committee can only recommend how many would be proper. This

committee is only to recommend what officers, in their opinion, are

necessary for the proper working of the Convention, and their com-

pensation.

MR. FILCHER. Mr. President: I offer as a substitute for the whole

matter the following resolution:

Resolved, That this Convention now proceed to the election, first, of a Phono-

graphic Reporter; second, a Sergeant-at-Arms; third, an Assistant Sergeant-at-
Arms; fourth, Minute Clerk.

MR. FILCHER. Mr. President: While I agree with the sentiments
of the original resolution, as offered by the gentleman from San Fran-
cisco, I take it for granted that the officers named in the substitute are
positively essential to the organization. While the officers I have
mentioned are necessary, it is more than likely that if we go on blindly,
and elect all the officers, we will elect officers which are not essential.
I know there are candidates here for most of the offices of which it is
usual to fill in legislative bodies, and having their friends they will be
placed in nomination, and the Convention will likely proceed to elect
them without stopping to consider whether we really need them or not.
My idea is or I take it for granted-that we need the officers I have
mentioned, and I am in favor of proceeding at once to the election of
these officers, and then provide for this committee asked for in the
original resolution. In other words, I would go as far as the election of
these officers that we know that we need, and then have this committee
appointed to see what further officers we need.

MR. JOHNSON. Mr. President: I understand that the resolution
was this morning that we proceed to the election of Secretaries. That
resolution has not been reconsidered.

THE PRESIDENT. That resolution has been carried out and the
Secretary elected.

MR. MCFARLAND. Mr. President: I call your attention to the fact
that the resolution specifies Secretaries in the Journal. The word used
was Secretaries.

MR. WILSON, of First District. In one portion of the law it says
Secretaries, and in another place it says Secretary. I think we had
better have the report of a committee on the officers needed, and have
their compensation fixed, and then we can go ahead.

THE PRESIDENT. The original resolution will be read again.
The Secretary read the resolution.

MR. BARBOUR. Mr. President: I move to amend by adding "ex-
cept the Phonographic Reporters."

THE PRESIDENT. The question is now upon the amendment
offered by the gentleman from San Francisco, Mr. Barbour.

MR. WATERS. Do I understand the Chair that the question will be

upon the amendment?

THE PRESIDENT. The original resolution was offered by the gen-

tleman from San Francisco, Mr. Wilson. Mr. Barbour moves to amend

THE PRESIDENT. Mr. Johnson having received the majority of all by adding the words "except the Phonographic Reporters." Mr.
the votes cast, I pronounce him the Secretary of this Convention.
plause.]

[Ap-Filcher has also offered a substitute, and the Chair rules that the ques-

At twelve o'clock and fifty-five minutes P. M., on motion of Mr.

Smith, of Santa Clara, the Convention adjourned to three o'clock this

afternoon.

The Convention reassembled at three o'clock P. M., President HOGE in
the Chair. Roll called and one hundred and forty-two members present.
J. A. JOHNSON, Secretary elect of the Convention, came forward to

the President's desk and took the oath of office, the same being admin-

istered by President HOGE.

MR. WATERS. Mr. President: I then appeal from the decision of

the Chair.

THE PRESIDENT. The gentleman from San Francisco offered the

original resolution. The gentleman from Placer, Mr. Filcher, offers a
substitute, and the gentleman from San Francisco, Mr. Barbour, offered
an amendment to the resolution. The Chair decided to put the ques-
tion on the amendment first, from which the gentleman from San
Bernardino appeals. The question now is, Shall the decision of the
Chair stand as the decision of the Convention?

MR. ESTEE. I hope the appeal will be withdrawn, and that the
Chair will change his views, because, according to all parliamentary
usages, a substitute takes precedence-takes the place of the whole

MR. WILSON, of San Francisco. Mr. President: I have a resolu-matter, including the original resolution.

tion which I desire to offer.

THE PRESIDENT. The gentleman will send up his resolution.

The Secretary read the resolution, as follows:

MR. HAGER. Mr. President: I concur with the views of Mr. Estee.

Resolved, That the President appoint a committee of seven, to report the desig- A substitute is in the nature of an amendment-of a second amend-
nation and number of officers other than President, Secretary, and Sergeant-at-ment-and that comes first. If the substitute is adopted, that takes the
Arms, as, in their opinion, are necessary for the transaction of the business of this
Convention, and the compensation to be paid to each where not fixed by law.

place of the whole matter. There will be no necessity of amending the
first proposition if the substitute is adopted.

MR. WILSON. Mr. President: I offer that resolution because MR. WATERS. Mr. President: I take the appeal with no feelings
the law authorizes this Convention to appoint such suitable officers of captiousness, but from the fact that I have seen that ruling made
as it may deem necessary for the transaction of its business, and here three or four times in as many days, and it appeared wrong to me.
I understand from gentlemen of greater legislative experience than I am firmly of the opinion that the ruling is wrong. Now, in order
I have, that we need certain specific officers; and, to have it clearly that we may not settle down into error in the very beginning, I raise
before the Convention, I think it would be better to have a committee this question now, and I think it behooves us to change that ruling. If
to report what officers would be necessary, and their compensation, we go wrong in a matter as trivial as this, if we start in in error we must
where that is not fixed by law. For instance, I understand that we follow it up. It is clearly the fact that the substitute offered by the gen-
shall need a Journal Clerk. Some other gentleman thinks we shall tleman from Placer is in the nature of an amendment; the substitute in
need an assistant or assistants; that we shall have a number of door- reality is an amendment to the amendment. Now, the question is upon
keepers, and gentlemen differ as to how many. Some think that we the amendment to the amendment, or the substitute. We had better
should have two Phonographic Reporters; others think that one will be | right ourselves now, and refuse to sustain the Chair.

MR. MCFARLAND. I will ask that the substitute be read again. Mr. President, there is always a great deal of learning expended upon questions of order at the opening. In my opinion the substitute is out of order. The main proposition of the original resolution is that a committee be appointed for the purpose of determining what we need. Upon that an amendment was offered by the gentleman from San Francisco, Mr. Barbour, that a portion of the resolution be stricken out. That was in order. That was germane to the original proposition. And then comes the substitute. You call it a substitute, ignoring the whole proposition, and opposing any committee at all, and assuming that the Convention shall go on and elect its officers. I don't think it is a proper amendment at all. I do not think that any amendment ignoring the original proposition entirely, and saying that the Convention shall go on and elect officers, is germane to the question at all; it is out of order. If the Convention is not in favor of it, the proper way is to vote down the amendment, and then comes the proposition of Mr. Filcher, to proceed to elect officers. I do not understand that I can introduce a substitute that ignores the original subject-matter entirely. Therefore, I make the point of order, that the substitute is out of order. THE PRESIDENT. The Chair will assign his reasons for his decision. I understand that we have no rules yet and therefore we are governed by the general parliamentary law. I understand it to be well settled that the friends of a resolution have a right to put it in the shape they desire, perfect it by amendments and get it into the shape they want it. Then, if any one wants to move a substitute for it, it may be done; but the vote is first taken on the amendments to the original resolution. MR. EDGERTON. Mr. President: From what little experience I have had, I had arrived at the same conclusion as expressed by the Chair, that the friends of a resolution have a right to perfect it before a substitute can be considered; and I will state to the other gentlemen, Mr. Waters and Mr. Estee, that their impressions are derived from a rule of the Assembly and Senate, that is always understood to be a modification of the general principles of parliamentary law. It is a special rule of California.

MR. FILCHER. Mr. President: In order to facilitate matters, and to prevent this tangle, as the object can be obtained in another way, and I had no further object in view than to elect the officers we know we have to have now, I will withdraw the substitute.

MR. WATERS. In that case, I will withdraw my appeal. THE PRESIDENT. The question is now on the amendment as offered by the gentleman from San Francisco, Mr. Barbour, to add the words, "except the Phonographic Reporters."

The amendment was lost.

THE PRESIDENT. The question now comes on the original resolution of the gentleman from San Francisco, Mr. Wilson.

MR. HALE. Mr. President: I move to amend the resolution by adding after the words "Sergeant-at-Arms," the words "Assistant geant-at-Arms."

ence to the death of any party. It is sufficient in this Convention, and
a single suggestion on the part of any member here is enough to estab-
lish that fact. That is the custom of Courts, and therefore it is not
necessary that a committee shall be appointed for that purpose. As I
remarked, we will evidently have a Committee on Privileges and Elec-
tions.
MR. BARNES. Mr. President: I quite agree with the gentleman
from Alameda, Mr. Van Dyke, on this matter, that we do not need to
appoint any committee for the purpose of ascertaining that which, if
it needs to be made known officially to the Convention, can be made by
the suggestions of the delegates from those Congressional Districts where
those vacancies exist. It is enough, it seems to me, to state that in the
Second Congressional District there is a vacancy created by the death
of a delegate at large, the Hon. H. H. Haight; that in the Counties of
Merced and Mariposa there is also a vacancy created by the death of
G. M. Hardwick. As to the vacancy caused by the absence of the mem-
ber from San Francisco, the Convention has had that information com-
municated through a letter signed by Thomas Morris, who was elected
at the recent election, and the signature to it was witnessed by one of
his colleagues from San Francisco, Mr. Barbour. As far as that matter
is concerned, sir, it seems to me that the resolution is out of order. Per-
haps at the proper time, when the Convention shall have been fully
organized, when these vacant districts shall have been represented and
shall be represented here, it will be proper to make inquiries as sug-
gested by the gentleman from San Francisco as to the eligibility of all
gentlemen claiming seats in this Convention, but so far as vacancies to
which I have alluded are concerned, I think we have now got to that
point when these vacancies should be filled, and, therefore, preliminary
to introducing a resolution on that subject, I move to lay the resolution
temporarily on the table.

MR. ESTEE. Mr. President: I second the motion. Such a motion as that I never before heard of in any legislative body. The idea of a Committee on Credentials I never heard before.

THE PRESIDENT. This is a motion to lay on the table, and is not debatable.

The motion was put and carried.

MR. BARNES. Mr. President: I desire to offer a resolution:

Resolved, That this Convention do forthwith proceed to fill the vacancies in this body, created by reason of the death of the Hon. H. H. Haight, of the Second Con

gressional District, and the death of the Hon. G. M. Hardwick, in the Counties of Merced and Mariposa, and by the resignation of Thomas Morris, of San Francisco. Resolved, That the nominations for candidates to fill that vacancy be named and made in the order named in this resolution.

MR. HOWARD. I rise to a point of order. The organic Act fixes the order of business until the officers mentioned therein are elected. We cannot proceed to any other business. That is the only rule under Ser-which we can proceed; it is the only rule that we have now in force. It seems to me very clear that no other business of the Convention on any of these matters can be proceeded with until that order of business shall have been executed.

MR. WILSON. Mr. President: The reason I put it in that shape is, that we may want more than one Assistant Sergeant-at-Arms. This resolution does not change the power of the Convention at all.

MR. HALE. In that case I will withdraw my amendment.
THE PRESIDENT. The question is now on the original resolution.
The resolution was adopted.

THE PRESIDENT. I will appoint as such committee S. M. Wilson,
J. E. Murphy, Volney E. Howard, Henry Larkin, Joseph C. Brown,
Walter Van Dyke, and Patrick Reddy.

TO FILL VACANCIES.

MR. REYNOLDS. Mr. President: I desire to offer a resolution: Resolved, That the President appoint a committee of five, whose duty it shall be to inquire into, and to whom shall be referred all matters concerning the eligibility of members and the filling of vacancies, and that such committee shall be required to report at the morning session on Thursday next.

MR. BARNES. Mr. President: I move to lay the resolution temporarily on the table.

MR. BARNES. Mr. President: In respect to the resolution I will say my reasons are these: the Convention is now sufficiently organized to fill vacancies existing in this body-known vacancies. Each of the Congressional Districts have a right to representation on this floor. Matters are coming up now on further organization of the Convention, upon which Congressional delegates are entitled to represent their constituency here. For that reason I suggest that before any further business is done we proceed to fill these vacancies. That is the object of the resolution.

THE PRESIDENT. The Chair is of the opinion that the Convention is now sufficiently organized by the election of a President and Secretary; that it has power to go on now and fill any vacancies in the body. The Chair overrules the point of order taken by the gentleman from Los Angeles. The question now is on the resolution offered by the gentleman from San Francisco, Mr. Barnes.

MR. REYNOLDS. Mr. President: I desire to pay the gentleman the same compliment that he paid me. I therefore move to lay the resolution temporarily on the table. My reasons for so doing

THE PRESIDENT. A motion to lay on the table is not debatable; the gentleman will please take his seat.

On the motion to lie on the table, the ayes and noes were demanded On the call of the roll the by Messrs. Howard, Ayers, and Huestis. motion was lost by the following vote:

Andrews,
Ayers,
Barbour,
Barry,
Barton,

MR. REYNOLDS. Mr. President: That resolution refers to a matter of considerable importance, and to questions that should be settled at as early a day as possible. I do not wish to precipitate it with any undue haste, but merely introduce the resolution that the subject to which it refers may be referred to a committee appointed for that purpose, and the matters referred to the committee, so that such action may be taken as the Convention may deem necessary, in order that they may report to the Convention as early as possible. This Convention, Mr. President, seems to me to be organized in a very informal and unusual manner; but we will let that matter rest for the present. We have never had any Committee on Credentials; there never has been a report to this body, nor in any manner have we officially ascertained who are members of this Convention. It has been conceded that there are some vacancies, and I am sorry to say, by the hand of death, but there is no official knowledge of that fact, and I know of no way to arrive at it, other than Beerstecher, the way I have indicated. It has been conceded since we met, that Bell, there were questions of the eligibility of the sitting members. Now let Brown, us have a committee appointed to whom the whole thing may be Burt, referred, with instructions to report at as early a day as possible. I Condon, think that is the best way to come at it. Cowden, MR. VAN DYKE. Mr. President: It strikes me that the gentleman's Cross, motion is entirely premature. He suggests as a reason for offering it Davis, that we do not know who are the members of the Convention. The law designates that those who are proclaimed members by the Governor are entitled to be sworn in and take their seats and exercise their duties until inquired into, usually by the Committee on Privileges and Elections, Dudley, of Solano, which I presume this body will in due time appoint. That generally Evey, follows after a body is organized. Therefore, I think that the resolu- Farrell, tions are premature now. In reference to the appointment of it, he Filcher, said he did not know that we have any evidences of vacancies here. It Freeman, is a universal rule that the suggestion to a Court is sufficient in refer- Freud,

Dean,

Dowling,
Doyle,

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THE PRESIDENT. The Convention refuses to lay the resolution on the table. The question is now on the resolution. MR. ANDREWS. Mr. President: I hope that resolution will not be adopted at this stage of the proceedings. It seems to me rather soon to go into that matter. This Convention is vested with the power to act in behalf of the people represented by these delegates. It seems to me that we should not exercise that power in the midst of the confusion consequent upon organization. It seems to me that we should have an assistant at that desk, and a Sergeant-at-Arms elected by this Convention. It seems to me that we should have a Minute Clerk. And I hope that the resolution will not be adopted at this stage of our proceedings.

THE PRESIDENT. The question is on the adoption of the resolution. The ayes and noes were demanded, and the resolution lost, by the following vote:

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MR. O'SULLIVAN.

PHONOGRAPHIC REPorters.

Mr. President: I have a resolution to offer:

Resolved, That a committee of five be appointed to examine, as experts, into the qualifications of the candidates for Phonographic Reporters of this body; also, as to the probable cost of the reports, to report to-morrow.

MR. O'SULLIVAN. Mr. President: I offer this resolution, sir, because I wish to have competent reporters appointed for this body; and I want a committee of gentlemen who are capable of judging as to their qualifications, and also because I have heard on the streets that there is a job in this twenty-four thousand or twenty-five thousand dollars is to be made out of it. If there is any such sum in it, it must be a steal, and I want to see no stealing.

MR. EDGERTON. Mr. President: I move to lay the resolution on the table, for the reason that in my judgment the subject-matter is covered by the resolution of the gentleman from San Francisco, Mr. Wilson, passed by this body.

Carried.

RULES AND ORDER OF BUSINESS.

MR. ESTEE. Mr. President: I offer the following resolution:

Resolved, That a committee of nine be appointed by the Chair to draft rules and an order of business, and report the same to this Convention for its consideration.

MR. FREEMAN. Mr. President: I move to amend by adding, "and that the committee report what standing committees shall be formed."

MR. EDGERTON. I rise to a point of order. As I understand parliamentary law, the duty of designating committees always falls upon the Committee on Rules. That is the rule in the Senate and Assembly in this State, in the House of Representatives, and in the United States Senate, and as far as I am advised, of every State in the Union. It is universally the custom for the Committee on Rules to designate the committees. MR. FREEMAN. Mr. President: I think it is a perfectly proper amendment and makes the matter perfectly clear.

MR. EDGERTON. Mr. President: I withdraw my point of order; it is a very small matter.

MR. ESTEE. Mr. President: The amendment does not do any harm, though it is not necessary; I accept the amendment.

THE PRESIDENT. The question is now on the resolution as amended. MR. WEST. Mr. President: I would offer a resolution as a substitute to that resolution: That the following standing committees be appointed by the Chair-First, on rules; second, privileges and elections; third, printing; fourth, accounts and expenditures; fifth, preamble and bill of rights; sixth, legislative department; seventh, executive department; eighth, judicial department; ninth, elective franchise; tenth, education; eleventh, public institutions; twelfth, public debt and public works; thirteenth, militia; fourteenth, county and township organization; fifteenth, apportionment of representation; sixteenth, revenue and taxation; seventeenth, municipal corporations; eighteenth, corporations other than municipal; nineteenth, miscellaneous subjects; twentieth, amendments to the Constitution; twenty-first, schedule; twenty-second, intoxicating liquors; twenty-third, enrollment; twenty-fourth, revision; twenty-fifth, agriculture.

MR. WEST. Mr. President: I offer the resolution at this time as a substitute, and I believe that the Committee on Rules should be a standing committee. I am not particular about the adoption of the substitute at the present time, but I think the experience of this Convention is that the Committee on Rules should be one of the standing committees of this Convention, and I move the adoption of the substitute.

MR. ESTEE. Mr. President: It is entirely unusual to adopt a resolution in that way; it is the universal custom with resolutions of that character that they be referred to the Committee on Rules, because it is necessary for us to fix the number, and it is one of the most important duties of this Convention. I would ask the gentleman to let the original resolution be adopted, and then refer his resolution to that committee for its consideration.

MR. WEST. Mr. President: I accept the suggestion of the gentleman. MR. MCFARLAND. Mr. President: I rise to a point of order that I would like to have decided at the commencement; it is, that the substitute is entirely out of order.

THE PRESIDENT. The substitute is withdrawn, sir.

MR. EDGERTON. Mr. President: I move to amend the resolution of the gentleman from San Francisco by inserting the word "fifteen " instead of "nine," so that the committee may consist of fifteen members instead of nine.

MR. ESTEE. Mr. President: I accept the amendment.
The resolution was adopted.

MR. SMITH, of Santa Clara. Mr. President: I offer the following resolution:

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OF THE CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION.

FIFTH DAY.

WEDNESDAY, October 2d, 1878.
The Convention reassembled at ten o'clock A. M., President Hoge in

the chair.

Roll called, and members found in attendance as follows:

Andrews,
Ayers,
Barbour,

Barnes,

Schomp,
Shafter,
Shoemaker,
Shurtleff,

DELEGATES PRESENT.

Hale,

Overton,

Hall,

Porter,

Harrison,

Prouty,

Harvey,

Pulliam,

Barry,

Heiskell,

Reddy,

Barton,

Herold,

Reed,

Beerstecher,

Herrington,

Reynolds,

Belcher,

Hilborn,

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Hitchcock,

Berry,

Holmes,

Rhodes,
Ringgold,
Rolfe,

Biggs,

Howard,

Schell,

Blackmer,

Huestis,

Boggs,

Hughey,

Boucher,

Hunter,

Brown,

Inman,

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Johnson,

Campbell,

Jones,

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Caples,

Joyce,

Casserly,

Kelley,

Chapman,

Kenny,

and pa

Charles,

Keyes,

Condon,

Kleine,

Cowden,

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Terry,

Dowling,

Lewis,

Tinnin,

Doyle,

Lindow,

Townsend,

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Dudley, of San Joaquin, Mansfield,

Tully,

Dudley, of Solano,"

Martin, of Santa Cruz, Turner,

Dunlap,

McCallum,

Tuttle,

Eagon,

McComas,

Vacquerel,

Edgerton,

McConnell,

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Estey, of Contra Costa, McCoy,

Estee, of 1st District,

Evey,

Farrell,

Fawcett,

Filcher,

Finney,

Freeman,

Freud,
Garvey,
Glascock,

Gorman,

Grace,

Graves,

Gregg,
Hager,

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Van Dyke,

Van Voorhies,
Walker, of Marin,

Walker, of Tuolumne,
Waters,

McFarland,

McNutt,

Miller,

Mills,

Webster,

Moffat,

Weller,

Moreland,

Wellin,

West,

Wickes,

Morse,
Murphy,
Nason,
Nelson,
Neunaber,

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The minutes of yesterday's proceedings were read and approved.
MR. SMITH, of Santa Clara, asked two days' leave of absence for Mr.
Laine. Leave granted.

TO FILL VACANCIES.

MR. BARBOUR. Mr. President: I desire to offer a resolution:
Resolved, First-That the delegates at large from the Second Congressional Dis.
trict, and the delegates from the City and County of San Francisco be, and they are
hereby authorized and empowered to name the persons to fill the vacancies in their
respective delegations, caused by the death of H. H. Haight and the resignation of
Thomas Morris, and that the persons thus proposed be considered the choice of
this Convention.

Second-That the vacancy in the representation from the Counties of Mariposa
and Merced be filled by an election to be had therefor by this Convention.
Third-That the Convention reserves its right to reject any person proposed as
above provided, who may be found ineligible or deemed unworthy.

MR. DUDLEY. Mr. President: I move that we lay the resolution on
the table.

MR. BARBOUR. I call for the ayes and noes.

The ayes and noes were also called for by Messrs. Beerstecher and

White.

MR. HILBORN. Mr. President: I think the resolution cannot be entertained, because it is delegating to a member of the Convention a duty that can only be performed by the whole Convention, namely, the election of persons to fill vacancies.

THE PRESIDENT. The law provides that all vacancies shall be filled by the Convention. The Chair therefore decides that the point of order made by the gentleman from Solano is well taken, and that the resolution is out of order.

MR. BARBOUR. Is it not the action of the Convention to authorize a committee to fill vacancies?

THE PRESIDENT. The Chair has decided the question; does the gentleman take an appeal?

MR. BARBOUR. Yes, sir.

29

The question is, Shall the decision of the Chair stand as the judgment of
the House?

MR. HILBORN. Mr. President: By permission of the House, I
vides for this Convention: "In case any vacancy occurs by reason of the
would like to read Section 11 of the Act of the Legislature which pro-
death, resignation, or otherwise, of any delegate elected to said Conven-
tion, the same shall be filled by the Convention."

THE PRESIDENT. The Chair has stated the question and the ayes and noes have been ordered.

MR. EDGERTON. Mr. President: Before this vote is taken I wish
the Chair would read that portion of the law for the information of the
House.

"In case any vacancy occurs by death, resigna-
THE PRESIDENT.
tion, or otherwise, of any delegate elected to said Convention, the same
shall be filled by the Convention."

MR. AYERS. Mr. President: I do not consider that that resolution
would make it incumbent upon this Convention to vote for the candi-
dates who are to be presented. It is merely a mode to get those candi-
dates before the Convention. It is not final, nor would that nomination
be binding upon this Convention.

MR. BARNES. Mr. President: Those who sit in the rear of this assembly would respectfully request of those who enjoy proximity to the Chair, to bear in mind that what they say is of as much interest to us as him, and therefore would respectfully request that whatever is observed to the President be spoken in such a tone of voice that we may be able to hear at least an occasional word.

MR. BROWN. Mr. President: It appears to me from the reading of that resolution, that the matter would be final, and that what some of those interested in this matter decide upon and report to this House, the report is final in the case.

MR. AYERS called for the reading of the resolution, and it was again read by the Secretary.

MR. BARBOUR. Mr. President: If gentlemen had not been so anxious to suppress debate, I would explain the resolution. I think I It does not point out any particular mode in understand this law. which the Convention shall fill vacancies. As to the Counties of Mariposa and Merced, the death of their representative, I believe, leaves no delegation from those counties except jointly with some other counties. I think the resolution does not confine the Convention to the nominee of this committee filling these vacancies, for they have a reserved right to pass on the member after he is nominated by this delegation. In the first place the proviso is that they shall name the person to fill the vacancy, and report the choice to the Convention. My object in making this proposition is to take that struggle out of this Convention. I believe it is conceded on all hands, at least by a majority of this Convention, that this is a proper mode to proceed to fill those vacancies. If that be the case, my resolution is only to obtain the sense of the Convention upon this proposition; and if they nominate persons acceptable to the Convention they can be notified of their nomination and come I think it is the first and proper order of here and take their seats. There is no intention to bind the Conbusiness that we should do so. vention. If they have already agreed upon the candidates, well and good; if not, let these delegates get together and name persons acceptable to their constituency. That is my object in presenting the resolutions. I have nothing to conceal. The San Francisco delegation have agreed unanimously on the man they propose to present; his name John R. Sharpstein, who received the highest vote of any man in San Francisco. We claim that it is our privilege, and if the other delegates are ready we are willing to concede to them the same right. If they are not ready we will wait for them to present a candidate. We claim that the person called upon to fill a vacancy of this kind ought to correspond in sentiment, in political affiliation, as near as may be, with the person whose death has caused the vacancy. I see nothing, sir, wrong in that. It seems to be a matter of justice, and we place it on the grounds of justice, and we ask it of this Convention as a matter of justice.

MR. ESTEE. Mr. President: As I understand this question, this resFrancisco delegation of thirty members shall elect a delegate representolution, divested of all circumlocution, means simply this: that the San the only power it leaves in the Convention is to reconsider their action ing that district. That is all it means, and just what it means, because thirty representatives from San Francisco, known as representing the if the member they recommend is ineligible. Now, sir, of course the who is not qualified under the Constitution. Second, there is no power workingmen of that city, so-called, will not present anybody here left in this Convention if the resolution should be adopted that the San Morris, who has resigned. Now, that should be the resolution, and the I hope it will not be adopted. I Francisco delegation of thirty shall elect a delegate in the place of Mr. believe that this whole Convention should pass upon the qualifications question comes squarely before us. MR. BROWN. Mr. President: I agree with the gentleman who has of every member who is placed before the Convention. just occupied the floor. It appears to me that in this case the matter to Francisco, or from any other portion of this State, to elect to fill vacanbe considered is, whether or not this body, according to the law under which we are acting, has a right to commission the delegates from San If we find the men that they have elected, set forth, that is before us. cies that have occurred. This appears to me to be a plain proposition objections to their filling this place, we can expel them afterwards. to fill these vacancies are ineligible, or that there are constitutional it does appear to me that the principle is plain in the law with regard to this matter, that it is the duty of this Convention not to set the San

But

THE PRESIDENT. The resolution that has just been offered to the Convention has been read. The decision of the Chair is that the resolu-Francisco members, or any other members, to the transacting of business tion is out of order, inasmuch as the law provides that the Convention itself shall fill all vacancies. The Chair decides the point well taken, from which decision the gentleman from San Francisco takes an appeal.

[Cries of "Question, question."] which this body is responsible for according to the law, but that this Convention itself should attend to this, as the law itself plainly requires.

MR. CROSS. Mr. President: In this matter I shall vote to sustain

the Chair and for this reason: I believe that the law which provides how this Constitutional Convention shall be composed, plainly provides that all vacancies shall be filled by the Convention, and that that takes away from this Convention the power to say that the presiding officer shall fill vacancies, or that Governor Irwin shall fill vacancies, or that the San Francisco delegation shall fill vacancies, and I trust, sir, that the right feelings that exist in a majority of this Convention, that their feelings of justice and their disposition to require the law to be complied with-I say I trust to the right feelings of this Convention to elect men who will be satisfactory to the men who elected Mr. Morris.

MR. BARBOUR. Mr. President: I withdraw my appeal.
THE PRESIDENT. The resolution is ruled out of order.

Resolved, That the President appoint a committee of seven to report the designation and number of officers other than President, Secretary, and Sergeant-at-Arms, as in and the compensation to be paid to each when not fixed by lawtheir opinion are necessary for the transaction of the business of the Convention, Beg leave to report that they have found the following additional officers necessary: First, a President pro tem.; second, two Assistant Secretaries; third, one Minute Clerk; fourth, one Journal Clerk; fifth, one Assistant Sergeant-at-Arms; sixth, three Doorkeepers; seventh, two Porters; eighth, eight Pages; ninth, one Postmaster; tenth, one Mail Carrier; eleventh, one Phonographic Reporter and one assistant. We recommend that the following compensation be allowed to the officers: First, to the Assistant Secretaries and Journal Clerk, $6 per day; second, to the Minute Clerk, $8 per day; third, Doorkeeper, $5 per day; fourth, to the Porters, $4 per day; fifth, to the Pages, $3 per day; sixth, to the Postmaster, $4 per day; seventh, to the Mail Carrier, $100 per month; eighth, to the Reporters, $10 per day and 20 cents per folio for transcribing. We also recommend the election by the Convention of the following officers: President pro tem., cne Reporter, two Assistant the other officers named to be appointed by the President of the Convention. All of which we respectfully submit. S. M. WILSON, Chairman. October 2, 1878.

MR. SMITH, of Santa Clara. Mr. President: I desire to offer a reso- Secretaries, one Minute Clerk, one Journal Clerk, one Assistant Sergeant-at-Arms; lution:

Resolved, That the Secretary of State be requested to distribute to each member of the Convention a copy of the Statutes of 1877-8, if he has a sufficient number.

JUDGE HAGER stated that any member could obtain the Statutes from the Secretary of State or State Librarian, on application, and Mr. Smith thereupon withdrew his resolution.

COMMITTEE APPOINTED.

THE PRESIDENT here announced the following Committee on Rules and Order of Business: Messrs. Estee, Edgerton, Overton, Mansfield, Schell, Berry, Fawcett, Reynolds, West, Holmes, Murphy, Dudley, Pulliam, Tinnin, and Waters.

ABOUT PAY.

MR. WYATT. I desire to offer a resolution:

Resolved, That the President of the Convention be instructed to appoint a com mittee of five, whose duty it shall be to ascertain and report to this Convention on Saturday, at the forenoon session thereof, the amount due each member of the Convention for mileage and per diem to date of report.

MR. WYATT. Mr. President: I hope that the resolution will meet with the unanimous vote of this Convention, and I have but little question but that it will. I was induced to offer it myself because I was aware of the known timidity of the members of the Convention on that subject, and, therefore, in order to relieve them, I took the responsibility of offering it myself. I believe that the committee proposed by the resolution adopted yesterday and appointed this morning do not contemplate the duties mentioned in the committee which I propose, and it is for that purpose, to supply that omission, that I offer the resolution. MR. VAN DYKE. Is there really any necessity for that resolution? The law fixes the compensation and mileage of every member here; it is simply a matter of computation. I don't see the necessity of the

resolution.

MR. EDGERTON. I move to lay the resolution temporarily on the table, for the reason that the Code fixes the mileage and per diem of members of the Convention at the same rates as of members of the Legislature, and also fixes the distance from each county seat to the City of

Sacramento.

MR. WYATT. Mr. President: If the gentlemen know the fact that a member can step into the Treasurer's office, or into the Controller's office, or into the office of the Secretary of State, or into the office of some other authorized State official, and draw his money, then I am satisfied that the resolution lay upon the table. But unless he can answer that that is a fact, then I want some way that this Convention can unlock the strong box of the State and get at some of that one hundred and fifty thousand dollars that is lying there rusting; and, as I understand it, Mr. President, there must be some authority from this Convention as a basis for those officers to act upon. I do not understand that I can step into the Controller's and say, "My name is Wyatt. I am a member of the Constitutional Convention. I am from Monterey County; my legal distance is one hundred and ninety-six miles. I have been here ten days, and I want a warrant for one hundred and thirty dollars, or one hundred and ninety dollars, or one hundred and seventy-five dollars, as the case may be." I understand that this Convention is to certify to what I am entitled to receive from time to time. MR. HAGER. It is well enough to understand this question at this time. I will inform the Convention that the statute provides how this money shall be drawn from the treasury. The amount of pay shall be certified by the President, and shall be paid by the Treasurer, on the warrant of the Controller, in the same manner as members of the Legislature are paid. The President may now certify that there is so much due any member, if he sees fit to do that. The mileage question is generally ascertained by a Committee on Mileage and Expenses, which is generally a standing committee. When the Committee on Rules make their report, there will be a provision for a Committee on Mileage or Pay, or a committee that will control that question, and then they make a general report in regard to all the members. The per diem allowance that may be due, can be drawn upon the certificate of the President. I would therefore suggest to the gentleman to let the matter rest until the Committee on Rules make their report, when the proper committee will be named that will have the power to regulate this matter.

MR. CAPLES. Mr. President: I second the motion to lay on the table, for the reason that it appears to me that this knocking at the doors of the treasury before we are organized is in bad taste. The motion to lay on the table prevailed.

MR. AYERS. Mr. President: Before that report is adopted I would like, if it is not out of order, to move that the price be reduced from twenty cents to fifteen cents per folio for transcribing.

THE PRESIDENT. The first question is upon the reception of the report.

MR. BEERSTECHER. Mr. President: I move that the report be received.

The motion prevailed and the report was received.

MR. HILBORN. Mr. President: I did not observe that there was any provision for a Night Watchman. That is one of the most important offices about the building. It is essentially necessary. I move that the report be amended so as to include a Night Watchman, with a salary of three dollars per day.

MR. LEWIS. Mr. President: I would ask for information, what is the duty of the Night Watchman?

MR. SHOEMAKER. Mr. President: The Night Watchman provided by the Secretary of State occupies the corridor below. It is very necessary that there should be somebody here to look after our desks, because any key will unlock our desks, and there should be some protection for

our papers.

MR. HILBORN. Mr. President: I understand that the per diem heretofore paid to the Night Watchman has been five dollars, and I ask to amend so that the compensation shall be five dollars instead of three

dollars.

MR. BIGGS. Mr. President: It has been the rule to have a Watchman for the day as well as for the night, and I therefore move to amend by having a Day Watchman also.

THE PRESIDENT. The gentleman from Butte can make the motion as soon as the present one for a Night Watchman has been decided. The motion prevailed.

MR. BIGGS. Mr. President: I now move that we have a Day Watchman at four dollars per day.

MR. VAN DYKE. Mr. President: The Door-keeper can keep charge of the hall during the daytime when not in session.

MR. BEERSTECHER. Mr. President: I would like to know why we intend to employ three Door-keepers, a Sergeant-at-Arms, and an Assistant Sergeant-at-Arms, if they are not to perform these duties in the daytime at the salary they are to receive.

MR. BIGGS. I withdraw the motion to save discussion. THE PRESIDENT. The question now recurs upon the adoption of the report.

PHONOGRAPHIC REPORTERS.

MR. AYERS. Mr. President: I shall renew my motion, that the figure for reporters' transcripts be reduced from twenty cents per folio to fifteen cents per folio. The figure now allowed by the State for the Reporter of the Supreme Court is twenty cents per folio, and the work there is not constant, but occasional. In this case we shall have a very large and important piece of work that will last perhaps for a hundred days, and I think that the compensation of fifteen cents per folio will amply repay the gentlemen who may be chosen as Phonographic Reporters. MR. FREUD. I second the motion.

MR. WILSON, of First District. Mr. President: The committee, in fixing the compensation for reporters, made some inquiries upon that subject, and the price fixed is the price allowed by Courts for making reports of judicial proceedings. It seems to me that the labors of reporting the proceedings of a legislative body are much more difficult and arduous, and this is only the same rate allowed for Court reporting. The difference is very small between fifteen and twenty cents per folio. We thought on fixing it at the ordinary rate because it was more arduous than Court reporting; that it would be fair to the Convention and economical to the State. We made inquiries and learned that to be the fact. I think, therefore, that it ought to remain in the report as it is. We require them to be in constant attendance, we require the best skill, and I believe every gentleman will want the proceedings written up very particularly. Under these circumstances, it seems to me that the compensation should remain as it is in the report.

MR. AYERS. Mr. President: I will merely state, in reply to the gentleman, that there certainly cannot be any difference in the labor of transcribing the proceedings of this Convention and in transcribing judicial proceedings. It is a mere mechanical process. The fact that there will be a great deal of work will only make it necessary to have more

A motion by Mr. Noel, to grant an indefinite leave of absence to Mr. men to do the work. I think the price paid to amanuenses throughCampbell, was lost.

REPORT ON ORGANIZATION.

out the State is ten cents per folio for like service. That will leave the persons who are going to be stenographers a clear gain of five cents per folio. If the proceedings should be printed in octavo form, there would be seven folios on a page. The debates of the Pennsylvania Convention occupied nine octavo volumes. The difference between the MR. PRESIDENT: Your committee, to whom was referred the following resolution: charges of twenty cents per folio and fifteen cents would save to this

MR. WILSON, of First District. Mr. President: The Committee on Further Organization desires to report:

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