ight-to-a-finish fans believe that the best way is by carrying on the war ermany is conquered.

method means that millions of additional men must be killed or wounded le. Among them would be thousands-perhaps millions-of American boys. It also means that the folks at home must bear ever increasing s of privation and sorrow. No one can tell how long it would take. It be years. If so, we would have actual starvation, in place of the high living that we are now suffering under.

at the best way to crush Prussianism?

Socialists believe it is not. We believe that it is the longest way, and eve that it is the way that would cause the greatest amount of suffering. believe that the quickest way to crush Prussianism is by making peace. tell you why--and we believe the reason will appeal to any man or who has not gone crazy on the war.

Socialists of Germany were strong before the war, though not strong to prevent it, and they have been growing stronger ever since. It is tention to crush Prussianism and to unite with other nations in a treaty rmament.

don't you see that the fact that Germany is surrounded by enemies s them from doing this? The German people are driven together by n danger. If they can, the Socialists will oust the kaiser in the midst war, as the Russian Socialists ousted the czar, but Germany is not Rusd it is a more difficult process. All of the warring nations, including ny, have revolutions in sight if the war lasts long enough for them to alize, but it would probably take longer in Germany than in most of the , simply because of the fact that common danger solidifies the German

revolution in Germany is, therefore, much more likely to come quickly ce is made than if the war continues.

ur government would join with Russia in seeking a general peace conferthere can be but little doubt that this would soon result in peace.

s would remove the cause which is now preventing the Socialists of Gerfrom overthrowing kaiserism. There would no longer be any common r to drive the German people into a solid phalanx. They would immedidivide on the big question of abolishing Prussianism. All the terrible suf- of the past three years would help to throw the scale in favor of the lists.

1 Prussianism would soon be throttled.

s method would save the lives and limbs of the American soldier boys. It ■ prevent the awful privation, suffering and starvation of the folks at home would result from a continuance of the war. It would also bring grateful to the soldiers and the home folks of the other countries that are at war. nk it over calmly and without prejudice. If you do this, we are sure that vill agree with us.

Editorial Milwaukee Leader May 28, 1917.

The American Autocracy.

garding the issuance of passports to the Socialist delegates to the Stockconference, we quote the following from The Sheboygan Press: "Let these go and let the world have a full account of that conference. Our refusal the United States be represented will only furnish fuel for those who argue we are not interested in peace and in a world democracy. The Socialists ■ recognized party of this country, and we have no right to deny them the lege to confer with members of their party in other nations, so long as they within the full meaning of the law. To deny them passports will do this try more harm than good."

number of other newspapers actuated by a spirit of fairness have given exsion to similar statements.

ell may Comrade Branting, member of the Swedish cabinet and Comrade ille Huysmans of Belgium, secretary of the international Socialist bureau, stounded at the stupidly autocratic action of the United States government enying passports.

yone would be astounded at such action, except the sultan of Turkey, the ado of Japan, and Mister Nick Romanoff, ex-czar of Russia. It is right in with their regular habits.

1485

I didn't think much of. I had nothing to do with the reprinting or printing it, that was a leaflet ordered by the National convention. I had talks with Mr. Germer about printing or reprinting "The Proclamati and War Program." I remember one talk with him about "Why Y Should Fight," in which he told me that was not sold, it was not much goo We reprinted it two or three times, but it had nothing like the popularity "The Price We Pay." I went to work there the last week in June; made no of it. I do not remember having a talk with Mr. Reif about printing "Why You Should Fight." I had many talks with him. I may have talked with him about June 19th, but not about the printing of "Why You Should Fight." don't remember my first talk with him about that pamphlet. I imagine it w about the time it was printed, if I had any talks at all. The first talk I had with him was when he came and inquired as to when I was going to pay a bi I told him I had not contracted it. The pamphlet was printed in the America Socialist June 9th, and I think it was printed in pamphlet form the following week. I don't remember having any talk with Fritz Reif with me about printing the pamphlet "Why You Should Fight" about June 19th. It was printed by the Chicago Labor Printing Co., I believe, located at 1616 North Halsted S and it was the company with which Mr. Reif was connected, and it publishes the Arbeiter Zeitung. I wrote that pamphlet on May 28th and 29th, 1917. I don't remember what the first order was for that, the number of them; they had standing orders for all of those monthly organization leaflets; thos 1486 standing orders were filled regularly without any further order. I don know who ordered them, except I know there were a good many local throughout the country that had standing orders for leaflets. I do not remember of an order being placed for 300,000 copies of that pamphlet about June 19th The first I knew definitely such an order was placed was when I read it in the indictment. It was not in my department and I didn't see it when the order was made. I have never seen the order from the Socialist party, National office, to the Arbeiter Zeitung, Chicago, Illinois, which you now show me; the first I heard about it was when I read the indictment. I know nothing about an order that was placed about August 21st for the printing of 50,000 copies of "Why You Should Fight;" I was in Oklahoma City that day; I knew that it was reprinted, I didn't hear about that order.

After I wrote the pamphlet entitled "Why You should Fight" I gave the manuscript to Mr. Engdahl. I told him in his office that if he liked it to print it, and if he didn't, not to. He took the manuscript, but I didn't observe whether he looked over it; he didn't then. I next spoke to him about it when I saw it in The American Socialist, the edition of June 9th. I wrote the 'Price we Pay" on April 28th, gave it to Mr. Engdahl in his office, and said "here is an article to prove that we are going to get Socialism out of 1487 this world war, and he said he hoped we do. I told him to look it over and print it if he liked it, other wise not to.

I went down to Washington in connection with the Emergency Peace Federation and had a talk with Congressmen Stafford and Carey and Mason and Cooper, on the morning of April 3rd, and one of the conversations was of April 7th. I know that each of the three congressmen I talked to voted against our going into this war, according to the Congressional Record. I saw Congressman William E. Mason but no other congressman from Illinois. I wear to see men who were in sympathy with me on the matter. The pamphlet "The Price We Pay was printed as it appeared in the American Socialist: I don't know of any important changes, except correction of a few typographical errors; I did not compare it very carefully; the changes were so little important they did not impress me. When I wrote that pamphlet I had in mind the medical report by Dr. Exner which is in evidence. I had read it. I looked no further for that kind of information, that was quite enough; I never saw any official reports issued by the Medical Department of the United States Army; had no occasion to look at the American Medical Magazine concerning the facts of which I wrote; was not interested in looking further. I had enough, and didn't want to go beyond that. The official reports would have interested me, but I didn't know where to get hold of them. I do not know the facts as given out by the United States army reports concerning venereal disease in the army, except as given out in the newspapers. 1488 I saw the moving picture "The Battle of the Somme" at the Virginia

Theater, near the National office on Madison Street. The picture was put out by the French government, and was being sent around with the apThose proval of the United States government, so it stated on the screen.

дет

e the words as I remember them. I did not inquire into the fact as to that, wrote this immediately after and had no time; when I saw that on the reen that satisfied me. I know that films of that kind were sent out with e approval of the United Sates Government. I don't remember going to the ovies in 1917.

Item No. 3 is in the same form in which I prepared and wrote it, as near I remember; there may be a difference, but it did not impress me at the ne and does not recall itself to my recollection now. Looking at Government xhibit 43, being the Saturday, May 5th American Socialist, at the article titled "The Price We Pay," that refreshes my memory and I see there is a fference in that and the pamphlet. I omitted from the pamphlet the words running down German spies." I did not put in the pamphlet "The Attorney eneral was running down German spies;" I thought it might be offensive. don't remember striking it out; it may have been stricken out by somebody se, or I may have stricken it out. This is the first time I have noted that was stricken out, if I noted it before I have forgotten it; I wrote a good Ideal in those days. I don't know why it was stricken out. If it was 189 stricken out, it was to throw up in sharp relief this attitude of Attorney General Gregory about not caring a damn whether the food producers obbed the people or not. The attorney general, as I understood it, was reponsible for the acts of the Department of Justice, and there was a number f men at that time reported in the newspapers who were sent to prison for ot standing up when the Star Spangled Banner was played; not to my peronal knokledge; I was never sent to prison myself, and I never met Mr. regory. I know there is no such law. I cannot give the names of men who ere sent to prison on that charge; I have a reference or clipping to it, but haven't got a clipping here.

I recollect in article 7 of the pamphlet “The Price We Pay" about whenever ruth telling becomes safe and possible again that this war is to determine the uestion whether the chambers of commerce of the allied nations or of the entral empires have the superior right to exploit undeveloped countries. I ave read the President's Flag Day speech, but not what he had to say with espect to the causes of this war; I had read what he had to say with regará o the causes of our entry into the war. That speech meant something to me; think I understood the reasons set forth as far as anyone can understand Ir. Wilson. It is difficult sometimes for an honest man to understand him, and I had difficulty. I read the speech while I was in Washington, about

the wrongs inflicted by Germany on this country, and the destruction 490 of American lives in ships on the high seas; I had a clipping on the

destruction of more than 220 men and women in that way, knew they ad been sunk at sea according to newspaper reports, and the President's recital of that meant a great deal to me as to the cause we entered the war; the President said that was his reason. I read that reference in his speech. This war" means the European war; there was a war before we got into it. This pamphlet relates to the whole war question; there is another reference to our entry into the war; that relates to the European war. The pamphlet was written after we got into the war. The President's pointing out to the ongress on April 2nd that more than 225 human beings had been destroyed nade a very deep impression on my mind when I was writing that pamphlet ; I thought they should have been kept at home and in that way we would have kept out of war, I was willing to try anything to keep out of war. I read of he declaration made by the American Embargo Conference with respect to eeping people at home, and that idea coincided very largely with mine.

In division 5 of that pamphlet my reference, as I have testified on direct, vas to something that happened in Ireland between 1170 and 1918; and I ertainly took into account in writing this pamphlet the fact that the German

army had marched into Belgium, had outraged women, murdered chil1491 dren, destroyed cities, and laid the country in waste; I compared that

with what England had been doing in Ireland for three centuries; my Comparison was that England had done those things for seven centuries and Germany for three years; they are both atrocities. I knew that England is not one of the allies of the United States, but is associated with us in this war r we with her. I thought if we could show up England we could bring war to a conclusion more easily.

Taking the pamphlet as a whole, it is a pamphlet that is intended to cause men to enter the selective draft, but not to volunteer in the service of the United States Army. It has stated they could not escape it, and I think it

should have induced them to accept conscription. The pamphlet would a mate the enthusiasm of our people for Socialism, which is why I wrote ite and for the war, so far as it is a just war and we could make it so. I garded it as susceptible of being made a just war, but it was not a just wr then according to the way the allies had stated their terms and the Unite States stated our terms. The war was unjust. The war was started by Geog many against Serbia. Please distinguish between the war, and our entry in the war. Our entry into the war was inevitable; I objected to the word " justifiable" in the Proclamation, because I thought it was "inevitable" the should go in there.

I wrote the article "Why You Should Fight" which was published in the American Socialist of June 9th. Comparing that with the leaflet of the 1492 same title, both of which you show me, they are not the same, there are several changes. Mr. Germer caused most of them; he told me that be was changing it because it was too long. He told me why he changed it. Mr. Clabaugh told me that the pamphlet "The Price We Pay" was not illegal: he said he didn't see anything illegal about it; I asked him what he thought about it.

In the pamphlet "Why You Should Fight" the words "This is why you should fight" was intended for the people who would read it. The sentences following would not encourage enlistment; it was not written with the intertion of encouraging volunteering in the United States Army. It was writte with the intention of encouraging response to the selective draft in the United States. Another statement therein contained that I regard as encouraging suc things begins, "Learn your lesson well is all we ask;" continuing, that the world must be made safe for democracy; that lesson has been set for you by the ablest of schoolmasters; learn it, and one thing further, to tell a tyranny from a democracy when you have seen them; learn to distinguish democracy and when you go out for it bring home the goods. That answer is satisfactory to me; I don't know whether you like it or not. My intention in writing this pamphlet was that the effect of it would be to encourage enlistment on the part of our people in this war by mastering the science of arms and bringing democracy home to America; after they had taken it to Germany to bring it back 1493 here. I do not think the effect of this pamphlet would be encourage peo

ple to buy liberty bonds. I would like to explain that.

The Flag Day Speech appeared in the American Socialist of June 23rd, 1917. The speech appearing in the paper you show me is as I prepared it, as I re member it; there is no doubt about it in my mind. I started to write it the later part of the afternoon, at my desk in the first room on the Halsted Street side. and I started immediately after I got back from lunch about 1:30 P. M. I don't know that anyone was present in the room at the time. I wrote about a couple of hours. My attention was on the manuscript and I didn't notice anyone coming into the room while I was writing. Mr. Germer may have passed through; I was accustomed to that, so I would not remember. I don't remember that Mr. Engdahl was there I don't think he was. When I had finished writing the article I showed it to Mr. Engdahl about five that same afternoon, who was in the next room. and I went in to see him at the conclusion of writing it. I said "here is something I have just written about the Flag Day Speech. You might use it if you like it." He said, "all right, I will look it over" if I remember. I talked to him from half to three-quarters of a minute, and then I think I went home. I saw no one else in Mr. Engdahl's office. The reason I wrote that was because I was not in accord with the President's speech, I was deeply dis

appointed, I looked for something better than that. I believed the state1494 ment you have read from the President's speech of June 14th, on page

four, beginning "It is plain enough we were forced into the war," and about the insults and aggressions of the German Government leaving us no self-respecting choice but to take up arms in defense of our rights; and also that the military masters of Germany denied us the right to be neutral, filled our communities with spies and sought to corrupt our people in their own be half. Both sides did that.

I did not have the President's statement in mind when I made the speech in which I said that the reason for this stringent action is given as being fear lest German spies should send information to their government and that that same reason had been given for a nation wide campaign of intimidation and terrorisra in which school girls and boys. clerks, students and stenographers have been seized and heralded to the world as heads of the Imperial German Government secret Service. I didn't say the United States heralded them, I said the news

's did, and as I before stated, the newspapers are largely professional liars. eved the statement in the President's Flay Day Speech when he said, reig to Germany, that they sought by violence to destroy our industries and t our commerce, and tried to incite Mexico to take up arms against us, and aw Japan into a hostile alliance with her. I knew nothing to the con; the President said so.

I was Chairman of the People's Council about that time and afterwards. The words you read from that speech of the President telling that Germany and her foreign office was attempting to promote peace made an impression upon my mind, and the President had been doing the thing for three years. The President did not warn me that peace was thing emanating from the German foreign office; I am no pro-German; he d that in the Flag Day Speech. I regarded it as a Flag Day Speech made e veterans at Arlington Cemetery at Washington, and it was a speech to he citizens of the United States. I knew at that time there was no peace America, and I said so in “The Price We Pay" and also in the constructive program, in the words "There is no peace anywhere until Socialism comes stops the cause of war."

my reply to the Flag Day Speech, in saying that President Wilson told hy we are going to war, partly to wrest the Berlin to Bagdad Railroad 1 Germany, I had reference to his words that the demands made by Ausupon Servia were a mere single step in a plan which compassed Europe Asia, from Berlin to Bagdad, and what he said in his speech next followconcluding with the words, "From Hamburg to the Persian Gulf the net read." This is all about the Berlin to Bagdad railroad. That is my untanding of the explanation as given by the president, that we went to war rder to wrest the Berlin to Bagdad Railroad from Germany.

In my speech in the passage you quote I meant that it was an oversight of the little commonwealths, Bohemia, Hungary, Balkans, the Turks and the subtile people of the east that they did not request the ted States to set them free from Germany; they ought to have done so but forgot it. There is no reference in the President's speech to the German's mpt to prevent our shipping munitions of war to their enemies; I think he ided reference to that very pointedly. By the words "The Germans atpted to influence our opinion in their own behalf, hence our blood must be 1 to destroy them," I meant that the president stated that the Germans set h their views of the conflict in the American newspapers, and my point of v was that so did the British, and I did not see any more reason why we uld go to war with Germany for that particular reason than with Great tain, for the reason that Great Britain bought more of our papers than many did. That is all I meant on that head.

told Mr. Engdahl I was going to write some stuff for the forthcoming edia of the Liberty edition, more than a week before it went to press; the Liby edition went to press on June 30th. It was about the time I delivered to this Flag Day speech. I didn't remember that this morning, but do rember it now, I have seen the notice of it in print. At the time I handed the g Day speech to Mr. Engdahl I said, "here is something I have written; you can run it if you like, otherwise not." Then, perhaps the next morn7 ing he told me he was going to get out a July fourth edition, and I said that he ought to have something about the Declaration of Independence, he asked me will I write something, and I said yes, and I did, and here it I don't think anyone else was present other than Mr. Engdahl; I acted as cor and got out one of the editions of the American Socialist when Mr. dahl was in Washington. The edition of the paper of July 24th shown me tains an article "Buy a liberty Bond", but that paragraph was cut out ore it went; it was in the edition that I prepared but it did not go through mail. I wrote that article and I did not think it would have the effect of sing people to buy Liberty Bonds. I was opposed to Liberty Bonds; it did. go out, I found it was illegal and I chiseled it out of the paper before the er went through the mail, the moment I found there was any suspicion of because my desire was to obey the law. I had no suspicion before that e that it was illegal, if I had I would not have put it in. The items indied by you in the paper, I had nothing to do with the preparation with that t of the paper; they were sent in by Mr. Kruse; he read the proof on it and imply put it in the forms; I did not read it over, I had too much to do to d Kruse's stuff.