4. We do not object to educating and training our youth for positions needed elsewhere, but we should keep more at home and not bankrupt our community by leaving only geriatrics. Many of our youth would love to stay on the farm if they could.

5. The Mann Creek project could contribute most by giving stability to existing local enterprises such as stable supply of alfalfa, feed grains, and silage crops for better quality production of livestock.

6. Make possible for some small supplementary cash income in the production of perishable fruits, vegetables, and melons for which there is a tremendous local demand, especially in the upper country. This would be such crops as peaches, cherries, strawberries, and melons, and tomatoes or other vegetables.

7. By having all-season irrigation, it would make possible the use of interruptible hydropower for irrigation pumping, which power is largely useless for any other purpose. This interruptible hydropower can serve no other purpose at the present time. In this development, we see a revival and continuation of our wholesome community life with a maximum contribution of good citizenship, cultural and economic well-being, with a minimum negative contribution to migrant or unemployed population. This project is well received by all segments of our overall Weiser community.

At all rural area development-RAD-meetings led by the Extension Division of the University of Idaho, a land-grant institution, water projects, such as the Mann Creek Reservoir project, have been given priority in all discussions. These discussions and planning groups are made up of leaders of all segments of our community such as chamber of commerce, farm bureau, farmers' union, cattlemen's association, beet growers, wool growers, fruit growers, small industries and other, including Idaho Power.

Mr. Chairman and members of the committee, we appreciate your attention in considering our relatively small project and hope that it might receive favorable consideration.

Mr. ROGERS. Thank you, Mr. Gunn. It is nice to have you here. Mr. Tarter, I believe you are the next witness. Mr. Tarter, you may proceed.

STATEMENT OF HERBERT TARTER, WEISER, IDAHO

Mr. TARTER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I am Herbert Tarter, of Weiser, Idaho. I am here to testify on the proposed Mann Creek Dam. I have lived on Mann Creek for 45 years and have been farming on my own since 1938. Prior to that time I lived with my parents on an adjoining ranch which they purchased in 1917.

My operation is raising cattle and hogs and the feed to feed them. My operation is limited by the amount of feed I can raise with the present water supply. My crops consist of hay, grain, and ensilage. Most of my grain is raised on dry land, except for crop rotation on the irrigated ground.

In 1961, which I consider was close to an average year, my first rop of hay yielded 3,600 bales of hay averaging 71 pounds per bale on 50 acres with 1 irrigation. The second cutting which had no water yielded 450 65-pound bales. My ensilage crop was about 60 percent of what it would have been with plenty of water, even though I robbed other land to irrigate it.

From this and past experience, I feel I could, with the increase in second cutting, a third cutting, and irrigated pasture, afford to pay the proposed assessment.

Thank you.

Mr. ROGERS. Thank you, Mr. Tarter, for your statement.
Our next witness is Mr. C. J. Williamson.

STATEMENT OF C. J. WILLIAMSON, CHAIRMAN, MANN CREEK IRRIGATION DISTRICT, WEISER, IDAHO

Mr. WILLIAMSON. Mr. Chairman and members of the committee, my name is C. J. Williamson. I am chairman of the board of directors for the Mann Creek Irrigation District. I have been a member of that board since about 1955. I was on the Farm Bureau committee for about 3 years before that. The sole purpose of this was to inquire into ways and means of reactivating the district and contacting the Bureau of Reclamation for reinvestigating the project. In this purpose we were successful.

I have lived on Mann Creek all my life and have lived on my present farm since 1927. During this time, I have farmed about 85 acres of land with one of the poorest water rights in the valley. The rest of the farm was dry-farmed.

In order to try to raise the family income, we purchased an adjoining farm, which has about 15 acres of orchard and one of the best water rights. The return from the land with the poor water right is not much better than that on the dry land. We have water for only one crop of hay and possibly some pasture and the grain crop is not much, if any, better than that on the dry land. On the orchard land we have enough water to mature crop but have enough to maintain the trees only if we use clean cultivation, which is not good for most varieties of fruit. This is important as Mann Creek is considered a very good fruit-producing area and ready market is close by, and I have never known a complete crop failure due to frost.

The Mann Creek Irrigation District was formed for only one purpose to get a full water supply-and has been maintained by voluntary contributions from 95 percent of the landowners. The size of this group of witnesses shows the interest of the people in this project. since the board of directors planned to send one, or at most two, and we have received enough donations to send four.

Thank you.

Mr. ROGERS. Thank you, Mr. Williams. Let the Chair say we are very happy that they got up enough donations to send all four of you because it is nice to have you here representing your people. Off the record.

(Discussion off the record.)

Mr. ROGERS. Back on the record.

We will adjourn at this time and start questioning you at 9:45 in the morning. If there are members who come in late, if you all will be available we will just proceed to question you at that time and complete the hearing.

Thank you very much.

The subcommittee will stand adjourned until 9:45 in the morning. (Whereupon, at 12 noon, the subcommittee adjourned, to reconvene at 9:45 a.m., the following day, January 25, 1962.)

MANN CREEK FEDERAL RECLAMATION PROJECT

THURSDAY, JANUARY 25, 1961

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES,

SUBCOMMITTEE ON IRRIGATION AND RECLAMATION OF
THE COMMITTEE ON INTERIOR AND INSULAR AFFAIRS,

Washington, D.C. The subcommittee met, pursuant to adjournment, at 9:50 a.m., in the committee room, New House Office Building, Hon. Walter Rogers (chairman of the subcommittee) presiding.

Mr. ROGERS. The Subcommittee on Irrigation and Reclamation will come to order for further consideration of pending business which is H.R. 529, by Mrs. Pfost, to authorize the Secretary of the Interior to construct, operate, and maintain the Mann Creek Federal reclamation project, Idaho, and for other purposes.

When we adjourned yesterday we had the witnesses from the Mann Creek area, Mr. Jackson, Mr. Gunn, Mr. Tarter, and Mr. Williamson before us. They had made their statements before the subcommittee, but there were no questions at that time. So if those gentlemen will come back to the witness stand, we will proceed with the questions.

Please come forward.

STATEMENTS OF HERSCHEL JACKSON, SECRETARY OF BOARD OF DIRECTORS, MANN CREEK IRRIGATION DISTRICT, WEISER, IDAHO; EVERETT GUNN, DIRECTOR, MANN CREEK IRRIGATION DISTRICT, WEISER, IDAHO; HERBERT TARTER, WEISER, IDAHO; AND C. J. WILLIAMSON, CHAIRMAN, MANN CREEK IRRIGATION DISTRICT, WEISER, IDAHO-Resumed

Mr. JACKSON. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. ROGERS. The Chair will recognize the chairman of the full committee, the gentleman from Colorado, Mr. Aspinall, for any questions.

Mr. ASPINALL. Mr. Chairman, I would like to reserve my time.
Mr. ROGERS. Mr. Nygaard.

Mr. NYGAARD. I would reserve my time.
Mr. ROGERS. Mrs. Pfost.

Mrs. PrOST. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I would like to compliment the gentlemen from Weiser for their very fine testimonies. They came here with their statements completely prepared, and this does not frequently occur, that people come from the States who are prepared with the required number of statements ahead of time.

I would appreciate you gentlemen extending my appreciation to the rest of the people who are in the irrigation district for their financial

support in sending you here to explain this project so that the members. of the subcommittee may have the benefit of your knowledge and experience and, in turn, we will relay your information to the members of the full committee. My deep appreciation for your help.

Mr. JACKSON. Thank you, Mrs. Pfost.

Mr. MORRIS. I would like to ask a couple of questions, Mr. Chair

man.

As I understand, you gentlemen are farmers on the project; is that correct?

Mr. JACKSON. That is correct.

Mr. MORRIS. Do they raise very much alfalfa seed on the project? Mr. JACKSON. Some, not very much.

Mr. MORRIS. Do you know what the yield per acre on alfalfa seed is, approximately?

Mr. WILLIAMSON. Alfalfa seed is raised more on dry land than on irrigated land.

Mr. MORRIS. It is?

Mr. WILLIAMSON. Yes.

Mr. MORRIS. So it is not actually in the project?

Mr. WILLIAMSON. It is mostly, as I say, on dry land rather than on the irrigated land.

Mr. MORRIS. I am not quite sure I understand it. It is on dry land. It would not be irrigated then, would it?

Mr. JACKSON. It may be. You see some of the new land is already farmed, but the water would go on it.

Mr. MORRIS. As I understand it is not presently receiving water from the project and some of it would grow alfalfa.

Mr. JACKSON. Yes.

Mr. MORRIS. What yield do you have?

Mr. WILLIAMSON. It depends. It probably goes from a hundred pounds per acre on down to 50 pounds.

Mr. MORRIS. Between 50 and 100 pounds per acre?

Mr. WILLIAMSON. Yes.

Mr. MORRIS. What kind of alfalfa do you grow there?

Mr. WILLIAMSON. There are different kinds. I think it is called

ranger.

Mr. MORRIS. You do not have the blight-resistant variety?

Mr. WILLIAMSON. Yes, we have different varieties, but ranger is the

most profitable.

Mr. MORRIS. Ranger is the most profitable?

Mr. WILLIAMSON. Yes.

Mr. MORRIS. That is all the questions I have.

Mrs. PFOST. Will the gentleman yield?

Mr. MORRIS. Yes, I will be glad to yield to the very distinguished lady from Idaho.

Mrs. PrOST. Thank you very much.

Did not one of you gentlemen tell me you would probably be raising additional seed crops when you bring the 595 acres in because th supplemental water will be available?

Mr. JACKSON. Yes, I think I told you that in my statement.

Mrs. PrOST. What type of seeds would you grow then?

Mr. JACKSON. Probably it would be vegetable seeds like carrots o

hybrid corn, or something like that.

Mrs. PrOST. Do you grow any clover seed?

Mr. JACKSON. We have grown clover seed. We do not right now. Mrs. PrOST. Nothing but alfalfa in the seed line?

Mr. JACKSON. That is right.

Mrs. PFOST. Thank you very much.

Mr. SAUND. Will the gentleman yield to me?

Mr. ROGERS. Are you through, Mr. Morris?

I was going to recognize the gentleman from California next.
Mr. MORRIS. Yes.

Mr. ROGERS. The gentleman is recognized.

Mr. SAUND. Did you say you grow 50 to 100 pounds of alfalfa seed per acre?

Mr. WILLIAMSON. That is about right.

Mr. SAUND. How do you make a go of it, then? I have grown alfalfa and if I did not get more than that I could not make it.

Mr. WILLIAMSON. I was basing that on dry land. If it is prepared on irrigated land, it would be considerably more than that. On dry land that is about what it is. It is not only a seed, as you put it. The seed is not the only crop we get. The first crop, and then the seed is from the second crop, as a rule. That is the reason we get more. Mr. ROGERS. Are there other questions?

Gentlemen, do you raise any sugarbeets out there?
Mr. JACKSON. Not now, no. Well, we never have.

Mr. ROGERS. And you do not plan to if this bill is approved?

Mr. JACKSON. I do not know of anybody that plans to raise sugarbeets.

Mr. ROGERS. How far are you from a sugar mill?

Mr. JACKSON. Thirty or thirty-five miles.

Mr. ROGERS. Where is that sugar mill located?

Mr. JACKSON. In Nysa, Oreg.

Mr. ROGERS. Do you know what capacity that mill is, what size? Mr. JACKSON. No. I have seen it, but I do not know much about it. Mr. ROGERS. Have you ever tried to raise sugarbeets here?

Mr. JACKSON. In this district, you mean?

Mr. ROGERS. Yes.

Mr. JACKSON. No.

Mr. ROGERS. How many acres of land do you own there?

Mr. JACKSON. Ninety-six.

Mr. ROGERS. Mr. Gunn, how many do you own?

Mr. GUNN. I own 205 acres of cropland.

Mr. ROGERS. 205 acres of cropland?

Mr. GUNN. Yes.

Mr. ROGERS. Will you add to that holding if this bill passes? Mr. GUNN. Not to amount to anything. It might be just a tip or something to equalize.

Mr. ROGERS. Is that in single ownership, or is it yours and your wife's?

Mr. GUNN. My wife and I.

Mr. ROGERS. Mr. Tarter, how many do you own?

Mr. TARTER. I own 120 acres of farmland, but about half of that

is under irrigation.

Mr. ROGERS. You would hope to bring the rest of it in?

Mr. TARTER. No. It is above the ditches.

Mr. ROGERS. Above the ditches?

Mr. TARTER. Yes.