able, and injurious, and their Lordships were to be called upon to exert their powers of coercive legislation to make the colonists do what was plainly and demonstrably wrong. Under such circumstances, the thing could not stand. It was impossible that Parliament could support the Government in the course it was about to pursue, he, therefore, trusted the noble Viscount would hear reason, and allow the whole subject to go before the Committee; and if it could be shown that this Order in Council was inapplicable to particular islands, that he would consent to modify it, and further, that some pledge would be given that no measure of coercion whatever should be proposed, until it appeared, in the words of Mr. Canning, "that the opposition of the planters is founded not upon reason, but upon contumacy." to adhere to the line of conduct they had thority, but had been so unfortunate in hitherto pursued, he agreed with the noble selecting their occasion, that they had and learned Lord on the Woolsack, nay, placed those against whom they were to he went beyond him, and not only thought act in the right. The colonists, undoubtthe Committee unnecessary, but most un-edly were right in resisting the Orders in fortunate, and likely to be productive of Council, for they were absurd, unreasonvery great public evils. He thought the noble and learned Lord on the Woolsack was mistaken if he supposed that, on the general subject involved in the discussion of to-night, he differed from the majority of this House. He believed that every noble Lord went quite as far as the nobleand learned Lord in abhorrence of slavery, and in a desire to ameliorate the condition of the slaves, with a view to their ultimate emancipation. Their difference was not as to the object, but as to the means of accomplishing it. He denied that the Orders in Council made one step towards its attainment. It had been truly stated to have been the object of Mr. Canning to carry along with him the white population of the West Indies. Unless that population went along with the measures proposed, success was impossible; for, legislate as they pleased, they were the only instruments to carry the laws into effect. The new Order in Council threatening to coerce the chartered colonies by fiscal regulations, was a direct attack upon the independence of every one of them. They might as well, by order in Council, destroy their charters; for the effect of complying with these orders would be, practically, to place them in the same position as the Crown colonies. Did their Lordships know the nature of the Orders in Council, Ministers meant to enforce? Had they read the letter of Mr. Jackson, showing their gross absurdities, and that their effects would be actually to place the slave, in many instances, in a worse situation than he now held? Those Orders, he had no hesitation in saying, were founded in gross and utter ignorance of the state of the colonies. They applied to fourteen or fifteen different colonies, and yet required one uniform act of legislation. According to them, the slaves were everywhere to be clothed and fed in the same way, and to be subject to the same hours of labour, although variety of climate, and other circumstances, rendered it necessary, for the happiness of the slave and the security of the master, that there should be a difference in many of these particulars. But Ministers had not only departed from the principles laid down by Mr. Canning, and determined to act upon their own au Viscount Goderich could not admit the interpretation which the noble Lord gave to Mr. Canning's language. He never understood that that language contained a pledge, that in no case, after no lapse of time, and under no circumstances, would the Government think itself justified in acting in a manner different to that he then prescribed. When the noble Lord called upon him to give some sort of pledge, with respect to the conduct of the Government, whilst this inquiry was pending, he seemed to think he had a strange notion of his duty; that he was about to accede to the appointment of a Committee, with a predetermination to disregard and despise every tittle of evidence that might be produced before it. Although he did not wish that Committee to be appointed, and doubted its expediency, yet his sole object, if he were a Member of it, would be the investigation of truth; that being the principle on which he proposed to act, contained as much of a pledge as any Member of that House ought to be called upon to give Lord Wynford said, that his noble and learned friend on the woolsack had stated, that, although the colonies had passed laws in seeming compliance with the wishes of this country, yet, they had taken care that those laws should be such as to produce very little effect; however he was glad his noble and learned friend had only adduced one instance of this kind, had there been another, from his great knowledge of West-Indian affairs, he must have known it, and he was sure he would have brought it forward. The only instance he did state related to the admission of slave evidence, which he said was tramelled by the acts directing, that before a slave was examined, he must have a certificate from some minister of religion, and the overseer of the estate to which he belonged. He had ascertained, by inquiries made since his noble and learned friend made his statement, that he was entirely deceived as regarded a certificate being required from the overseer. It was true, that the slave was required to have a certificate from some minister of religion, but with whom did that provision originate but with Mr. Canning, who distinctly recommended it, and in consequence of whose recommendation it was adopted? so that that law, which his noble and learned friend stated had been passed to defeat the intentions of Parliament, had actually proceeded from the Minister upon whose resolutions all succeeding legislation had been founded. He thought it was a most wise provision; for, if slaves were to be received as witnesses in a Court of Justice, it must first be ascertained that they believed in the nature of an oath. But there was another point he would urge upon his noble and learned friend. If there was any objection to this law, how had it received the sanction of the British Government? As this was the only instance which his noble and learned friend had brought forward to prove attempts on the part of the colonists to do away with the effect of what they pretended to do in compliance with the wishes of the British Legislature, he had failed in making his case out. The noble and learned Lord had further stated, that he did not think that the expectations of the noble Duke, with respect to this Committee, would be realized, but that a very different case would be made out. He confidently hoped that his noble and learned friend would not prove correct in his opinion. Who applied for this Committee but the proprietors of property in the West Indies? They had been charged with many faults, but they had not been thought persons wanting in discretion, and, therefore, it was not likely that they would apply for this Committee, if they did not believe that the result of the inquiry would be in their favour. For his own part, he thought that the result would be to prove these Orders in Council unnecessary-and, if unnecessary, improper; for he agreed with the noble Lord (Lord Seaford) that any interference between master and slave, not absolutely necessary, was not only an improper interference with property, but an interference likely to lead to the most mischievous consequences, both to the whites and the blacks. When the noble and learned Lord said, that nothing had been done for the latter, did he forget the testimony which had been borne to the fact by the most rev. Archbishop? did the noble and learned Lord forget that, in 1815, the negroes were all Pagans, but that now they were nearly all Christians? He should have thought that making them Christians was conferring upon them the greatest boon it was possible to bestow; therefore, in his opinion, much had been done, as he trusted other noble Lords besides himself were fully persuaded, from what had occurred in the course of the debate. If their Lordships went into Committee, in the spirit so properly recommended by the noble Viscount opposite, it might turn out that everything had been done which, consistently with a due regard to the interest both of master and slave, could have been done for the benefit of the latter. He was glad to hear his noble friend say, that nothing like compulsory manumission was ever dreamed of. God forbid that there should be any thing like a forcing of the master to abandon his property in the slave! Once adopt that principle, and there was an end of all property. Property in slaves, in the West Indies, was acquired under the sanction of law-nay, more, under the encouragement of law; and, therefore, rested upon as good a foundation as any other property. That slavery was an evil, nobody could doubt; 'not on account of the relation which existed between masters and slaves in the West Indies, but on account of the criminality which belonged to it. He had not a sugar cane in the West Indies, but he should be sorry, upon principle, that the property of the West Indians should be assailed by a forced manumission of slaves. The Government ought to indemnify all who had acquired this kind of property, under the sanction of the Government. The Lord Chancellor begged their Lordships to bear in mind that his noble and learned friend had said, that, in no colonial legislature had any law yet been passed, announcing, as a condition to the admissibility of slave evidence, that the certificate of the overseer was necessary; he had no doubt, however, that point would be completely proved in the Committee, and that his noble and learned friend and informant had misled him. Petition to lie on the table. The Earl of Harewood then moved, that a Select Committee be appointed to inquire into the laws and usages of the several West-India Colonies, in relation to the slave population; the actual condition and treatment of the slaves, their habits and dispositions; the means which are adopted in the several Colonies for their progressive improvement and civilization, and the degree of improvement and civilization which they have at present attained; and also to inquire into the distressed condition of those colonies. Motion agreed to. ARREARS OF TITHES (IRELAND) BILL.] Viscount Melbourne moved the first reading of this Bill, the progress of which had been delayed by the pressure of other business. It had been his desire to see the Bill pass into a law previous to the recess, in order that it might afford a practical refutation of an erroneous opinion which prevailed in Ireland, that tithes were extinguished. This delusion, he was sorry to say, had caused resistance to the payment of tithes to show itself in districts which had not been before subject to any commotion or disturbance. Their Lordships were aware that it was the intention of the Tithe Committee to recommend some measure for providing a maintenance for the clergy of Ireland, more secure, more free from objections, and more reconcileable with the feelings of the country, than the existing system of tithes; but at present the law remained unaltered, and he wished it to be understood that the claim for tithe was legal, and resistance to it unjustifiable and contrary to law. Bill read a first time. Adjourned until Monday, the 7th of May. HOUSE OF COMMONS, MINUTES.] Bills brought in. By the LORD ADVOCATE, to solidate and Amend several Laws relating to the Cruel Treatment of Cattle:-By Mr. LoCH, to enable Burghs in Scotland to Establish a General System of Police:-By Mr. VERNON SMITH, to Regulate the Office of the Clerk of the Crown in the Court of King's Bench in Ireland:By Lord TULLAMORE, for holding the Assizes in the King's County in Ireland twice every year. Returns ordered. On the Motion of Mr. HUME, of the Number of Ships which passed the Sound during the year 1851, distinguishing their respective Nations; of the Number of Loads of Timber imported from the Baltic in each year, from 1827 to 1831, inclusive of the Number of Vessels, with the Amount of Tonnage which cleared out for the Deep Sea Fishery between 1827, and 1831; of the Tonnage of Vessels employed in the Coasting Trade which had entered in or cleared out during the same time; of a Letter from Mr. Hay, dated the 5th of March last, referred to in a Treasury Minute assigning Superannuation to Mr. Justice Stephen; of the Number of Parishes in Ireland, the Tithes of which are received by the Clergy of the Established Church, specifying their Names and Rank, the Amount of Income which each derived from such Parish if under the Com. position Act, or, if not under the said Act, the Sum paid on . an average of three years, distinguishing whether the Tithes be Rectorial or Vicarial, or if the Income is derived from Land allotted; of the Number of Stamps issued to each of the Newspapers and Advertizing Papers in Scotland in the year 1831; and an Account of the Advertisement Duty paid by each Paper in the same year; of the date of the Commission appointing Commissioners of Inquiry into the Charities of England under 1 and 2 Will. 4th, stating the Names and Emoluments of the Commissioners, and of all Persons attached to their Offices:-On the Motion of Mr. SPRING RICE, Report from the King's Proctor to the Lords of the Treasury, dated the 30th June, 1831, on the subject of the Compensation proposed for the Owners of the Ship Almorah, on account of the detention of that Vessel:-On the Motion of Mr. RUTHVEN, of the Number of Sturdy Beggars received into the Workhouse at Cork during the last twenty years; Foundlings remaining in the Establishment on the 1st of March, 1832; Children received from each Parish in the City during the last two years, with the Income, and Expenditure, from what Sources the Revenue is derived, and how the same was Expended; the same Returns for Waterford and Limerick: -On the Motion of Mr. WILKES, Return of all Religious Teachers and Missionaries, who had been Arrested during the present year at Jamaica, with the Charges against them, and all Accounts of Injuries to Places of Worship by Riotous Assemblages in the said Island, and all Proclamations issued thereon, and an Abstract of the Laws now in force as to Churches, Chapels, and other Places of Worship, and relating to the Ministers and Congregations meeting in the same :-On the Motion of Mr. Dixon, Copy of Memorandum entered into between Lord PONSONBY, and the Brazilian Government, dated May, 1829, relating to the Capture and Detention of British Vessels; of the Alienations of Crown Lands in New South Wales and Van Diemen's Land, respectively, during the last ten years →→ On the Motion of Mr. SADLER, of the Number of Burials in Manchester, from the years 1821, to 1850, inclusive, distinguishing each year :-On the Motion of Mr. GODSON, of the Number of Footpaths and Roads stopped up in the Parish of Berkhampstead, between June, and August, 1827. Petitions presented. By Mr. RUTHVEN, from the Inhabitants of Bangor, in favour of the New System of Education in Ireland:-By Mr. DOMINIC BROWNE, from the Guild of Nailers in Galway, for Equalizing Civil Rights in that Place; and from the Catholics of the Guild of Tanners, Magistrates, and Merchants of Galway of the same Re ligion, for the Repeal or Modification of the Stamp Duties on the Admission of Freemen to Corporations; and from the Inhabitants of Cong, for the Abolition of Tithes:-By Mr. SPRING RICE, from the Clergy, Gentry, and other Persons, residing in Ashbourne, Ratoath, and other Places, complaining of the Rates of the Tolls on the Roads in the Counties of Dublin and Meath; from the Landed Proprietors and other Rate-payers of the County of Tyrone, complaining of the present System of Taxe ation; by Grand Juries from the Physicians and Surgeons of the County of Down, complaining of the Law for Re firmaries in Ireland; from the President and Fellows of King and Queen's College of Physicians in Ireland, for subject of Anatomy; from the Corporation of Dover, against the Sewers Bill:-By Mr. MACKINNON, from the Inhabitants of Saffron Walden, and of Inhabitant House gulating the Admission of Medical Persons to County In their Rights to be preserved in any Enactments on the holders of Westminster, in favour of the Cruelty to Ani mals Bill:-By Lord MORPETH, from the Merchants of Leeds, complaining of their Vessels being Captured by the Brazilians: By Mr. SHAW LEFEVRE, from the Inhabit ants of Alton, for the Removal of the Punishment of Death for Offences against Property:-By Mr. WILKES, from the Inhabitants of South Lincoln, for the Abolition of Slavery:-By Mr. VERNON SMITH, from the Protest ant Dissenters and Inhabitants of Northampton, in favour FAST, MEMBER, from the Presbytery of Aberdeen, against the but it was in consequence of the manner in which the requisition was drawn up; besides which, there was an advertisement issued, calling upon all the inhabitants who loved the Bible and wished their children to be instructed from it, and who desired the temporal and eternal welfare of their offspring, to be present. The consequence was, a numerous attendance, and certainly many persons assembled to show that the plan was not opposed to the reading of the Scriptures in the schools. The gentleman who offered himself for of the Registration of Births Bill:- By the Earl of BEL- that purpose was cut short by the chairfrom the Minister and Congregation of the Presby-man, who observed, that he did not come to hear speeches but to receive signatures. In consequence of that remark, great rudeness had been offered to the chairman (Lord Dufferein), which he did not attempt to justify. The result, however, was, that his Lordship left the meeting and went to another place. Of what had there occurred, he pretended to give no account; but at the original meeting, another gentleman was called to the chair, and a petition was agreed to in favour of the plan, which had received quite as many signatures as that against it, and had it been hawked about in the same manner as the one presented by the noble Lord, he had no doubt the signatures would have been much more numerous. The question had provoked discussion; and persons found they had been deluded, and that the new system would by no means prevent a scriptural education. New System of Education in Ireland. TITHES (IRELAND).] Mr. Dominic Browne presented a Petition from the Parish of Cong, in the County of Galway, praying for the abolition of Tithes. Though he had supported, he said, the measure of the right hon. Secretary for Ireland, yet he always was of opinion, and he still retained that opinion, that the connexion between England and Ireland could not be maintained, unless the revenues of the church of Ireland were reduced in proportion to the number of the members belonging to that church in that country; and he thought that a reduction, to the amount at least of one-sixth, should be made in those revenues. At the same time, as long as a tax was legal it must be collected, and it was on that principle he had given his support to the Tithe Bill. Colonel Evans was authorized to say, that a petition against the Government plan of national education in Ireland, which had been presented as the result of a public meeting of the inhabitants of Manchester, had emanated from a packed meeting of some 200 persons at the most, and who were only admitted by tickets. Mr. James E. Gordon defended the pro EDUCATION (IRELAND)-PETITIONS.] Lord Castlereagh presented a Petition from Bangor in the County of Down, against the new system of Education in Ireland. The meeting from which it emanated, had been called upon a clear understanding that it should be attended by those only who were opposed to the system; notwith-moters of the Manchester petition against standing which the room was filled by persons who formed it into a political meeting, and under the pretence that the promoters of it were opposed to Reform, assailed the respectable gentlemen who had assembled for a different object, with most violent language, when Lord Dufferein who was chairman adjourned the meeting to another place, at which the petition he had now the honour to present was carried by a large majority. Mr. Ruthven was aware that some disturbance had taken place at the meeting, the charges which had been made against With said by the noble Lord (Castlereagh) | against the ruffianly conduct of the parties alluded to. This was another example of the attempts to promote the Government plan of education. Hisses; groans; "No Tories;""Down with the Tory Lord;" "We can now do without Lords;" "I'm as good a Lord as you are;" these were meet arguments, and they were generally used in support of such a system. Before he sat down, he had to complain of the great and serious inconvenience to which they were subjected on the presentation of petitions. It amounted, in fact, to the repression of public feeling upon subjects of the greatest importance. He had daily attended the ballot at ten o'clock for nearly three months, and in the whole course of that time he had not obtained more than three or four opportunities for presenting petitions intrusted to him. The consequence was, that he had at that moment, upwards of forty in his possession. On his own behalf, therefore, and on the behalf of numbers who were similarly circumstanced, he gave notice that, if the House did not come to some understanding in favour of a better arrangement, he should move a resolution on the subject immediately after the Easter recess. Sir Robert Peel said, that the inconvenience complained of was very generally felt, and observed that the custom of presenting petitions ought to be taken into consideration, with a view to the adoption of some plan by which the public business might be facilitated. He must also notice the fact, of a House not having formed yesterday. If that were done designedly by the Government, he thought, in the present pressure of business, that it was much to blame. The Marquis of Chandos fully concurred with the right hon. Baronet. The practice of not making a House, looked like a plan of the Government to avoid unpleasant discussions. Lord Althorp said, it was his anxious desire that the House should have met yesterday, and he had himself suffered inconvenience from the circumstance, having had a motion to bring forward on the subject of the Bank Charter. He agreed that some arrangement should take place with regard to the, presentation of petitions, and expressed his willingness to assist in any arrangement which would tend to facilitate the presentation of petitions, in order to expedite the general business. Lord John Russell said, that after the recess, he proposed to present two petitions in favour of the plan of education about to be adopted in Ireland. He was of opinion that it would not be desirable to prevent discussion on the presentation of petitions. He thought it would be a good plan that all petitions on the subject, for instance, of Irish education, should follow one another. Sir Robert Peel suggested that the subject of the presentation of petitions should be referred to a Committee, upon whose report the House might act. The consequence of the present system was, that petitions tending to inflame the passions of the people, took precedence of those of a grave, important, and domestic description. He gave notice, that after the recess, he would move for the appointment of a Committee on the subject. Mr. Robinson complained of the mode pursued by Government of keeping back Members for the purpose of preventing the formation of a House. He did not believe the absence of Members was accidental, and if such practices were persevered in he would find a means of retorting. Sir Matthew White Ridley denied that any such course was pursued by his Ma jesty's Government. Petition to lie on the Table POLAND.] Lord Althorp moved that the House at its rising do adjourn to May 7th. Mr. Cutlar Fergusson said, in pursuance of the notice he had given, he thought that was a proper time for him to bespeak the attention of the House, while he made some few remarks relating to the state of Poland. It was not a subject to which he felt himself peculiarly adapted, as it required knowledge and information which he did not possess, to enable him to discharge the duty he had taken on himself. He could unfeignedly declare that no task he had ever undertaken had pressed more severely on his mind, and on no occasion had he more need of the indulgence of the House. The deep interest which he felt in the fate of unhappy and heroic Poland, had rendered it impossible for him, however inadequate he was to the task, not to lend such aid as he could offer, to bring the subject fairly before Parliament. Since he had given notice of his intentions, some delay had taken place owing to accidental circumstances, which he did not however regret, because it had given an opportunity |