gram would be insofar as acid-grade fluorspar is concerned at the increased price of $56.50, which you suggest, and the payment set at $26.50 rather than at $8?

Mr. FLYNN. Senator, I think you could take the $26.50 and multiply it by the 180,000 tons, because I am sure most producers will require that $26.50 in order to operate.

Senator WATKINS. They will require the complete $26.50 to operate? Mr. FLYNN. I expect most of them will. I anticipate the foreign producers still have profit enough left to cut their prices further.

I would like to point this out: The figures which the Secretary of the Interior used, and I am sure it accounts for the wide difference between his estimate and our estimate, he used prices which were in effect, I believe, about the first of the year. During this session of Congress, there have been several bills introduced on the House side which would increase the duty on acid-grade fluorspar as well as the metallurgical grade fluorspar. At the time those bills were introduced, the price on the east coast was about $50 a ton for acid-grade fluorspar. But since those bills were introduced, the foreign producers cut their price to the $35 I mentioned here, so that accounted for the $15 that we have to figure on that the Secretary didn't take into consideration when he made this proposal.

I am certain that prices will go down another $2 or $3 per ton if this program goes through. I think the foreign producers will reduce their price $2 or $3.

Senator BIBLE. Then a direct answer to my question is that the maximum liability of the United States Government to carry out the acid grade fluorspar stabilization plan as suggested by you would be 180,000 tons multiplied by $26.50 a ton?

Mr. FLYNN. That is right.

Senator BIBLE. That would be the maximum?

Mr. FLYNN. That is right.

Senator BIBLE. If metallurgical grade fluorspar is to be added to the program, as you suggest, then the maximum liability there would be 140,000 tons, multiplied out by $25 per ton; is that correct?

Mr. FLYNN. That is right. That would be the maximum in each case; yes, sir.

Senator BIBLE. Insofar as the acid grade fluorspar program is concerned, the maximum liability, in your considered judgment, is the probable liability?

Mr. FLYNN. I think so, yes.

Senator BIBLE. Because of the state of the industry?

Mr. FLYNN. Yes.

Senator BIBLE. And increase the cost of Public Law 733 insofar as it concerned fluorspar from $53 per ton to $56.50 per ton, because of the different specifications requiring a dry concentrate; is that right? Mr. FLYNN. That is right.

Senator BIBLE. Those costs plus the shipping point plus the increased labor cost account for the $3.50 a ton; is that correct? Mr. FLYNN. That is correct.

When you stockpile acid grade concentrate, you don't stockpile it in dried form. It is too difficult to handle. It is much like trying to handle water. If you have 4 or 5 or 6 percent moisture content,

then you can handle it like damp sand. It is finer than sand. When you ship to a consumer, the consumer wants the concentrates dry. He wants to use them. We would have to dry them if we sold to the

consumer.

Senator BIBLE. Does the fluorspar industry suggest a purchase and stockpiling program in addition to the stabilization suggested?

Mr. FLYNN. No, sir. I think we are one of the victims of stockpiling. We have had about all of that that we care for, we would only ask for stockpiling as a last final resort.

Senator BIBLE. Would the stockpiling of any fluorspar that was in stock at the present time be particularly helpful.

Mr. FLYNN. There are no large stockpiles of finished material on hand, Senator.

Senator BIBLE. In that respect, your problem is not similar to either copper, lead, zinc, or tungsten; is that correct?

Mr. FLYNN. No, sir; it is not.

Senator BIBLE. I have no further questions, Mr. Chairman.
Thank you very much; you are always helpful, Mr. Flynn.
The CHAIRMAN. Thank you.

There is to be a joint session of Congress today, and I assume we better take a recess at this time until 2 o'clock.

(Thereupon, at 12:05 p. m., the committee recessed, to reconvene at 2 p. m., the same day.)

AFTERNOON SESSION

Senator BIBLE. The committee will be in order.

Mr. REDWINE. Mr. Chairman, some 10 days ago, when witness Karasik was testifying, Senator Malone asked the witness to furnish the committee with certain data regarding the individual members of his association. We have several letters in response to Senator Malone's request. I ask permission to insert those letters at this place. Senator BIBLE. Without objection, that will be done. (The documents are as follows:)

THE ORE & CHEMICAL CORP.,

New York, N. Y., June 13, 1958.

SURREY, KARASIK, GOULD & EFRON,

Washington, D. C.

(Attention Mr. M. Karasik.)

GENTLEMEN: Referring to page 1454 of the stenographic transcript of hearings before the Subcommittee on Minerals, Materials, and Fuels, we are pleased to submit the following data on our company:

Name: The Ore & Chemical Corp. (incorporated in the State of New York). Headquarters: 80 Broad Street, New York, N. Y.

General business: Nonferrous metals, residues, and scrap; ores; fluorspar; chemicals; semimanufactured metal products.

Interest in fluorspar: United States sales agents of Gewerkschaft Finstergrund, Baden Baden, Germany.

Connections with United States Government: We have no Government contracts or barter dealings with the United States Government, for fluorspar. Other information: We do not manufacture products from fluorspar.

Very truly yours,

E. MUGDAN, Vice President.

SAMINCORP (SOUTH AMERICAN MINERALS

& MERCHANDISE CORP.), New York, N. Y., June 13, 1958.

SURREY, KARASIK, GOULD & EFRON, ESQs.,
Washington, D. C.

GENTLEMEN: As a member of the Flourspar Importers and Producers Institute, we are submitting the following information about our company:

1. We are a New York corporation, organized under the laws of the State of New York.

2. We are the exclusive United States import sales agents for two mine operators situated at Cagliari, Sardinia, producing acid-grade filtercake fluor

spar.

We are also engaged in the following business activities:

(a) General agents in the United States for the Hochschild interests throughout South America.

(b) Importers of zinc, lead, copper, and other minerals supplied to American industry.

(c) Purchasing agents for the Hochschild group for export to South America of American mining machinery, chemicals, metals, and other industrial products. Our South American affiliates hold exclusive agency agreements with the major producers of the American chemical and metal industries.

(d) Independent traders in metal, scrap, and chemicals for domestic consumption as well as in the export and import of these commodities. 3. In order to support the continuity of production of acid-grade filtercake fluorspar, we have advanced substantial sums of money to our Sardinian producers so that modern equipment could be installed for more efficient and increased production by our mine operators for increasing their production for American consumption.

4. Although we did not have a direct contract with the United States Government, we did ship 15,000 tons of Sardinia acid-grade filtercake fluorspar to the United States during 1955 and 1956 for the United States stockpile under a contract with North American Continental Grain Co., of New York. North American had a barter contract to supply acid-grade filtercake to General Services Administration in exchange for grain purchased by them from the Department of Agriculture.

Respectfully submitted.

ERNEST FRAENKEL, Chairman of the Board.

P. S.-Presently we employ 52 people in our business activities.

E. F.

ARNOLD H. MILLER, INC.,
New York, June 12, 1958.

Re legal representation of members of Fluorspar Importers and Producers Institute.

SENATE INTERIOR MINERALS SUBCOMMITTEE,

DEAR SENATOR MURRAY: This will please certify that as a member of subject institute, our interests are being represented before your committee by Counselor Monroe Karasik, of the firm of Surrey, Karasik, Gould & Efron.

As for my connection with the fluorspar industry, I can state that I am sole representative of, consulting engineer to, and a member of the board of directors of Fluoruros, S. A. with head offices in Goya 67, Madrid, Spain, whose fluorspar mines are situated in Asturias, north Spain, on the Bay of Biscay. Fluoruros, S. A. was acquired by purchasing the fluorspar properties from the Allied Blocked Property Commission following World War II to whom the ownership of the properties had been delivered by the Spanish Government and which were confiscated from the Germans. These properties have been developed from a production of approximately 5,000 to 6,000 tons of metallurgical fluorspar per year to approximately 20,000 tons metallurgical and 30,000 tons of acid grade per year as of last year and will have a potential capacity of better than 100,000 tons per year upon completion of the beneficiation plants

now being installed near Ribadesella situated some 75 kilometers on the Bay of Biscay east of Gijón.

This increase in production has been achieved largely through the installation of equipment which was purchased in the United States with a loan from the Export-Import Bank in the amount of $400,000 which is to be paid back over a period of 25 years from 1953 at a rate of interest of 3 percent. It was our understanding when the money was borrowed for the machinery that the repayment would be made from imports of fluorspar into the United States. We did not require moneys for the installations in Spain or anything outside of the cost in the United States of the machinery and the shipping on American boats of the equipment to Spain.

I am not a buyer and seller of fluorspar. I am a producer of fluorspar and my only function is that of Fluoruros, S. A., of Spain.

Respectfully yours,

ARNOLD H. MILLER.

ASSOCIATED METALS & MINERALS CORP.,
New York, N. Y., June 13, 1958.

SUBCOMMITTEE ON MINERALS, MATERIALS, AND FUELS,
United States Senate, Washington, D. C.

(Attention: Hon. James E. Murray, chairman.)

GENTLEMEN: In accordance with the suggestion made at the hearing on June 11 (p. 1454) we desire to give you the following information concerning this company and its business.

Associated Metals & Minerals Corp. is a corporation organized under the laws of the State of New York in 1926. It is an importer, exporter, and dealer in ores, minerals (including fluorspar), metals, chemicals, steel, and certain byproducts.

It imports and sells domestically large quantities of acid-grade fluorspar for commercial use. It has had in the past several contracts with the General Services Administration which are classified. We assume that information concerning these contracts can be obtained by the committee from General Services Administration. It also has had one contract with Commodity Credit Corporation for the delivery of acid-grade fluorspar on a barter basis, for approximately 50,000 dry tons of Italian origin, which has been completed.

It now has an agreement with the Commodity Credit Corporation on a barter basis for approximately 50,000 tons of metallurgical fluorspar of Mexican origin. This latter transaction has, we think, no relevancy to the present hearing. If there is any further information which we can furnish germane to the present proceeding we will be glad to do so.

Very truly yours,

F. A. LISSAUER, President.

Mr. REDWINE. May this comment be made to develop a thought that Senator Malone had at the time. These letters show that one of the members, South American Minerals & Merchandise Corp., in 1955 and 1956, furnished 15,000 tons of Sardinian acid-grade filtercake fluorspar to the United States for stockpile under a bater program.

In the case of Arnold H. Miller, Inc., its mine in Spain was the beneficiary of the $400,000 loan from the Export-Import Bank, to be paid back over a period of 25 years from 1953, at an interest rate of 3 percent. That was for the development of its Spanish mine.

In the case of the Associated Metals & Minerals Corp. under the signature of their president it states that it has made delivery under the barter program of approximately 50,000 dry tons of fluorspar of Italian origin. In addition thereto it has recently introduced an agreement with the Commodity Corporation on a barter basis for approximately 50,000 tons of metallurgical fluorspar of Mexican origin.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Senator BIBLE. These letters will be carried in full in the record, together with the statement and analysis of Mr. Redwine.

Senator BIBLE. This afternoon we will start out with Mr. Adkerson, of the American Manganese Producers Association.

STATEMENT OF J. CARSON ADKERSON, AMERICAN MANGANESE PRODUCERS ASSOCIATION

Mr. ADKERSON. Thank you.

Senator BIBLE. We are very happy to have you with us, Mr. Adkerson.

Mr. ADKERSON. Thank you.

Senator BIBLE. Do you have a prepared statement, sir?

Mr. ADKERSON. No; I do not.

Senator BIBLE. You may develop the subject in your own way. Mr. ADKERSON. My name is J. Carson Adkerson from Woodstock, Va., speaking for the American Manganese Producers Association. Senator BIBLE. At that point you might for the record indicate who are component members of the American Manganese Producers Association.

Mr. ADKERSON. Manganese producers in the United States?
Senator BIBLE. About how many?

Mr. ADKERSON. Fifteen to 50 all told.

Senator BIBLE. It is a voluntary association?

Mr. ADKERSON. It is a voluntary association organized in 1927 by the producers themselves, purposedly as stated on the letterhead to encourage the beneficiation production and use of domestic manganese-bearing ores. We have been functioning since 1927 with offices in Washington.

Senator BIBLE. Very well, you may proceed.

Mr. ADKERSON. I appeared before this committee earlier in these same hearings and I asked permission at that time and it was granted that I may make a supplemental statement before the hearings closed. I will ask that this be considered as a part of the supplemental state

ment.

Senator BIBLE. This will be considered as your supplemental state

ment.

Mr. ADKERSON. I also ask at the end of these hearings if it is considered advisable by the committee that I can still file a supplemental statement.

Mr. REDWINE. Mr. Chairman, may I interrupt at this point to say that Chairman Murray has asked to be announced this afternoon that, due to the lateness in the session, anyone wishing to file a supplemental statement will have until Saturday of this week because we want to send the transcript to the printer as quickly as possible.

Senator BIBLE. I think it is very apparent that, since it is this late in the session, the hearings must be concluded without delay and we get down to actual legislation. As you understand, Mr. Adkerson, after the testimony of the Secretary on tomorrow, you may have until noon on Saturday to file your final statement, if you choose. After that date, it will be too late.

Mr. ADKERSON. On my earlier appearance before the committee I gave reference to and recommended passage of the Martin bill, known